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LeClerc

Feast of Firstfruits

Hi All

Leviticus 23
10. "Speak to the children of Israel, and say to them: 'When you come into the land which I give to you, and reap its harvest,  then you shall bring a sheaf of the firstfruits of your harvest to the priest. 11. He shall wave the sheaf before the Lord, to be accepted on your behalf; on the day after the Sabbath the priest shall wave it.

Is this a spiritual offering or a physical offering ?



LeClerc
Honey 56

This is interesting LeClerc.

Is it both?  

A kind of symbolic thanksgiving?
Physical on behalf of the offerer and the priest, and spiritual on behalf of them all (including YHWH.)

Honey.
cyberman

Re: Feat of Firstfruits

LeClerc wrote:
Hi All

Leviticus 23
10. "Speak to the children of Israel, and say to them: 'When you come into the land which I give to you, and reap its harvest,  then you shall bring a sheaf of the firstfruits of your harvest to the priest. 11. He shall wave the sheaf before the Lord, to be accepted on your behalf; on the day after the Sabbath the priest shall wave it.

Is this a spiritual offering or a physical offering ?



LeClerc


I'd say physical. The waving especially seems to suggest this.
Jim

Re: Feat of Firstfruits

Is there a difference? A sacrifice requuires effort, whether physical or spiritual.
The Psalmist wrote;
"Let the giving of thanks be a sacrifice to God."
In this instance, I don't think the writer was referrring to animal sacrifice, but a praise offering on the part of the one giving thanks.
bnabernard

Remember, remember what? remember.

bernard (hug)
bnabernard

Or to put it another (old way)
The devil was claiming that he could make man, so God said to him go on then. With that the devil started to grab hold of a handfulls of dirt.
God said to him, ere whats that you are doing, and satan replied I'm making a man.
So God said to him, 'go get your own dirt'

bernard (hug)
Ketty

Re: Feat of Firstfruits

Jim wrote:
Is there a difference? A sacrifice requuires effort, whether physical or spiritual.
The Psalmist wrote;
"Let the giving of thanks be a sacrifice to God."
In this instance, I don't think the writer was referrring to animal sacrifice, but a praise offering on the part of the one giving thanks.


I agree.  It's the thankful spirit behind our first fruit offering - whatever the offering may be.
LeClerc

Hi All

cyberman wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hi All

Leviticus 23
10. "Speak to the children of Israel, and say to them: 'When you come into the land which I give to you, and reap its harvest,  then you shall bring a sheaf of the firstfruits of your harvest to the priest. 11. He shall wave the sheaf before the Lord, to be accepted on your behalf; on the day after the Sabbath the priest shall wave it.

Is this a spiritual offering or a physical offering ?



LeClerc


I'd say physical. The waving especially seems to suggest this.


Would agree Cyberman

Now moving on.

1 Corinthians 15
20 But the fact is that the Messiah has been raised from the dead, the firstfruits of those who have died. 21 For since death came through a man, also the resurrection of the dead has come through a man. 22 For just as in connection with Adam all die, so in connection with the Messiah all will be made alive. 23 But each in his own order: the Messiah is the firstfruits; then those who belong to the Messiah, at the time of his coming;

Physical or spiritual ?

LeClerc
bnabernard

I expect many are confused because they read of Moses and Elijah and consider them resurected prior to the resurection of Yeshua, perhaps you could enlighten people out of their confusion?

bernard (hug)
Honey 56

Physical,

But imperishable and immortal, glorious and powerful, incorruptable and perfect. A spiritual body, but a body none the less.

Honey
LeClerc

Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
I expect many are confused because they read of Moses and Elijah and consider them resurected prior to the resurection of Yeshua, perhaps you could enlighten people out of their confusion?

bernard (hug)


The words of The Messiah, Y'shua, should help any confusion.

Matthew 17
9 Now as they came down from the mountain, Jesus commanded them, saying, "Tell the vision ( ὅραμα horama) to no one until the Son of Man is risen from the dead."

Compare with Acts 11
5 I was in the city of Joppa praying: and in a trance I saw a vision ( ὅραμα horama), A certain vessel descend, as it had been a great sheet, let down from heaven by four corners; and it came even to me:

LeClerc
bnabernard

Yes I'm sure that has cleared up the confusion,  

So there was Yeshua, beaten up, hung on a stuarus, bled dry of fluids, and then stuck in a cave for three days.

Now considering he most likely had a beard an all, and different clothes on, is it anywonder that this bedrageled half crippled personage is unrecognisable, even in good health dressed in strange clothes these bearded types all look pretty much the same.

bernard (hug)
Honey 56

Quote:
Yes I'm sure that has cleared up the confusion,  

So there was Yeshua, beaten up, hung on a stuarus, bled dry of fluids, and then stuck in a cave for three days.

Now considering he most likely had a beard an all, and different clothes on, is it anywonder that this bedrageled half crippled personage is unrecognisable, even in good health dressed in strange clothes these bearded types all look pretty much the same.

bernard (hug)




Indeed Bernard........

24Now Thomas (called Didymus), one of the Twelve, was not with the disciples when Jesus came. 25So the other disciples told him, “We have seen the Lord!”

But he said to them, “Unless I see the nail marks in his hands and put my finger where the nails were, and put my hand into his side, I will not believe it.”

26A week later his disciples were in the house again, and Thomas was with them. Though the doors were locked, Jesus came and stood among them and said, “Peace be with you!” 27Then he said to Thomas, “Put your finger here; see my hands. Reach out your hand and put it into my side. Stop doubting and believe.”

28Thomas said to him, “My Lord and my God!”
bnabernard

What are you saying to me, that Yeshua was a ghost that walks through walls, or that Yeshua was flesh that could not walk through walls, or that flesh does not exist as we know it and that it (flesh) can come and go at will providing there is a memory of it.

bernard (hug)
Honey 56

bnabernard wrote:
What are you saying to me, that Yeshua was a ghost that walks through walls, or that Yeshua was flesh that could not walk through walls, or that flesh does not exist as we know it and that it (flesh) can come and go at will providing there is a memory of it.

bernard (hug)


Put another way, and more importantly Bernard, what do the scriptures say?

Messiah Yeshua told His disciples Himself that He was not a spirirt/ghost, that He was 'flesh and bones' He ate with them and prepared food for them, he walked and talked with them, they were able to touch Him, He could appear at will to many many people, and yes, He could go through locked doors! not according to me, according to scripture.

You keep trying to put YHWH in a box Bernard, His ways are not ours, His ways are miraculous.

Can He defy the natural laws? not only that He controls them, the weather obeys Him, He can heal diseases and bring people back from death

Well, the natural laws are of His making and His to do with what He will!

He died for our sins on a cross and defeated sin and death by raising Himself up again, now that is miraculous.

Honey
bnabernard

Nice one Honey, we now have a man of flesh who appears out of thin air.
Is this like something out of star treck?

bernard (hug)
Honey 56

bnabernard wrote:
Nice one Honey, we now have a man of flesh who appears out of thin air.
Is this like something out of star treck?

bernard (hug)


Well Bernard if you equate the inspired word of God with science fiction?
Then maybe so? to you anyway!

Honey
Honey 56

BTW Bernard,
You are not the old bishop of Durham by any chance? cos' you are sounding more like him everyday.


Honey
bnabernard

Honey 56 wrote:
bnabernard wrote:
Nice one Honey, we now have a man of flesh who appears out of thin air.
Is this like something out of star treck?

bernard (hug)


Well Bernard if you equate the inspired word of God with science fiction?
Then maybe so? to you anyway!

Honey


Ficton, obviously what passes as fiction for some passes as reality to others.
Does Yeshua retain his form in the body or is it something like a coat on a hanger dispersed in the atmosphere?

bernard (hug)
bnabernard

Honey 56 wrote:
BTW Bernard,
You are not the old bishop of Durham by any chance? cos' you are sounding more like him everyday.


Honey


I'm going to mis old durham town, I'm going to miss old durham town, I'm going to miss old durham town, cos I'm leaving,

OOps now I'm Roger Whittaker  

bernard (hug)
Honey 56

bnabernard wrote:
Honey 56 wrote:
BTW Bernard,
You are not the old bishop of Durham by any chance? cos' you are sounding more like him everyday.


Honey


I'm going to mis old durham town, I'm going to miss old durham town, I'm going to miss old durham town, cos I'm leaving,

OOps now I'm Roger Whittaker  

bernard (hug)





Kernewek

Re: Feast of Firstfruits

LeClerc wrote:
Hi All

Leviticus 23
10. "Speak to the children of Israel, and say to them: 'When you come into the land which I give to you, and reap its harvest,  then you shall bring a sheaf of the firstfruits of your harvest to the priest. 11. He shall wave the sheaf before the Lord, to be accepted on your behalf; on the day after the Sabbath the priest shall wave it.

Is this a spiritual offering or a physical offering ?



LeClerc


I believe it is both,

first the physical of harvesting the offering.
secondly the spiritual,where the mind and heart are in harmony with YHWH's comandments.

Kernewek.
bnabernard

Hi Kernewek

A bumper crop off of bumper cropping land, thens its a touch of thanks mate this is just the ticket, or in this case God.

They did not choose that was done by God who gave the land to them, they could have picked a right barren lump.

Reconition of the provider and who it was that led them. innit

bernard (hug)
LeClerc

Re: Feast of Firstfruits

Hi Kernewek

Kernewek wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hi All

Leviticus 23
10. "Speak to the children of Israel, and say to them: 'When you come into the land which I give to you, and reap its harvest,  then you shall bring a sheaf of the firstfruits of your harvest to the priest. 11. He shall wave the sheaf before the Lord, to be accepted on your behalf; on the day after the Sabbath the priest shall wave it.

Is this a spiritual offering or a physical offering ?



LeClerc


I believe it is both,

first the physical of harvesting the offering.
secondly the spiritual,where the mind and heart are in harmony with YHWH's comandments.

Kernewek.


Just wondering if the spiritual aspect is likened more to the Festival of Weeks where the physical is likened more to the Feast of Firstfruits.

Leviticus 15
15 “‘From the day after the Sabbath, the day you brought the sheaf of the wave offering, count off seven full weeks. 16 Count off fifty days up to the day after the seventh Sabbath, and then present an offering of new grain to YHWH.

LeClerc
Kernewek

Re: Feast of Firstfruits

[quote="LeClerc:81801"]Hi Kernewek

Kernewek wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hi All

Leviticus 23
10. "Speak to the children of Israel, and say to them: 'When you come into the land which I give to you, and reap its harvest,  then you shall bring a sheaf of the firstfruits of your harvest to the priest. 11. He shall wave the sheaf before the Lord, to be accepted on your behalf; on the day after the Sabbath the priest shall wave it.

Is this a spiritual offering or a physical offering ?



LeClerc


I believe it is both,

first the physical of harvesting the offering.
secondly the spiritual,where the mind and heart are in harmony with YHWH's comandments.

Kernewek.


Just wondering if the spiritual aspect is likened more to the Festival of Weeks where the physical is likened more to the Feast of Firstfruits.

Leviticus 15
15 “‘From the day after the Sabbath, the day you brought the sheaf of the wave offering, count off seven full weeks. 16 Count off fifty days up to the day after the seventh Sabbath, and then present an offering of new grain to YHWH.

Thankyou LeClerc

Iwill reread Leviticus and pray on the matter, because I've not really considerd this before.

Kernewek
Kernewek

Re: Feast of Firstfruits

Quote:
Just wondering if the spiritual aspect is likened more to the Festival of Weeks where the physical is likened more to the Feast of firstfruits Leviticus 23,v15


15 “‘From the day after the Sabbath, the day you brought the sheaf of the wave offering, count off seven full weeks. 16 Count off fifty days up to the day after the seventh Sabbath, and then present an offering of new grain to YHWH.

Quote:
Thankyou LeClerc

Iwill reread Leviticus and pray on the matter, because I've not really considerd this before.

Kernewek


Hi LeClerc

have read Leviticus this do'es seem to be the case, the spiritual aspect of the two offerings are similar it is only the amount of space between the days that make a difference.


15 “‘From the day after the day of rest — that is, from the day you bring the sheaf for waving — you are to count seven full weeks, 16 until the day after the seventh week; you are to count fifty days; and then you are to present a new grain offering to Adonai. 17 You must bring bread from your homes for waving — two loaves made with one gallon of fine flour, baked with leaven — as firstfruits for Adonai. 18 Along with the bread, present seven lambs without defect one year old, one young bull and two rams; these will be a burnt offering for Adonai, with their grain and drink offerings, an offering made by fire as a fragrant aroma for Adonai. 19 Offer one male goat as a sin offering and two male lambs one year old as a sacrifice of peace offerings. 20 The cohen will wave them with the bread of the firstfruits as a wave offering before Adonai, with the two lambs; these will be holy for Adonai for the cohen. 21 On the same day, you are to call a holy convocation; do not do any kind of ordinary work; this is a permanent regulation through all your generations, no matter where you live.

Kernewek
LeClerc

Re: Feast of Firstfruits

Morning Bro

Kernewek wrote:
Quote:
Just wondering if the spiritual aspect is likened more to the Festival of Weeks where the physical is likened more to the Feast of firstfruits Leviticus 23,v15


15 “‘From the day after the Sabbath, the day you brought the sheaf of the wave offering, count off seven full weeks. 16 Count off fifty days up to the day after the seventh Sabbath, and then present an offering of new grain to YHWH.

Quote:
Thankyou LeClerc

Iwill reread Leviticus and pray on the matter, because I've not really considerd this before.

Kernewek


Hi LeClerc

have read Leviticus this do'es seem to be the case, the spiritual aspect of the two offerings are similar it is only the amount of space between the days that make a difference.


15 “‘From the day after the day of rest — that is, from the day you bring the sheaf for waving — you are to count seven full weeks, 16 until the day after the seventh week; you are to count fifty days; and then you are to present a new grain offering to Adonai. 17 You must bring bread from your homes for waving — two loaves made with one gallon of fine flour, baked with leaven — as firstfruits for Adonai. 18 Along with the bread, present seven lambs without defect one year old, one young bull and two rams; these will be a burnt offering for Adonai, with their grain and drink offerings, an offering made by fire as a fragrant aroma for Adonai. 19 Offer one male goat as a sin offering and two male lambs one year old as a sacrifice of peace offerings. 20 The cohen will wave them with the bread of the firstfruits as a wave offering before Adonai, with the two lambs; these will be holy for Adonai for the cohen. 21 On the same day, you are to call a holy convocation; do not do any kind of ordinary work; this is a permanent regulation through all your generations, no matter where you live.

Kernewek


Found this bro.

The Book of Ruth paints a beautiful portrait of the truth of Shavuot. Y’shua is our Kinsman-Redeemer. Yahudi by birth and non Yahudi by birth are condemned and separated from YHWH by our sin (Isa. 59:1-2). Y’shua was willing and able to save us, being YHWH God. But He had to become our Kinsman to meet all three requirements. That He did when He became a man. Through His redemption, Yahudi by birth and non Yahudi by birth are placed together in the body of Israel, partakers of the covenants by the Kippur or covering of the blood of Y’shua the Messiah (Eph. 2). Ruth (Not a Yahudi by Birth) and Boaz (a Yahudi by birth) became one in marriage (Gen. 2:24). Yahudi and non Yahudi become one in Israel by grace through faith in the shed blood of Y’shua, With the Book of Ruth being required reading on Shavuot, what better picture could be given of Messianic Believers?

Moshe gave Israel the Law; Y’shua brought us grace and truth and the power to obey YHWH’s Law, life lived by the Spirit of YHWH (2 Cor. 3). S

Shavuot came, the Law was given, and shortly thereafter three thousand people died. At Shavuot (Pentecost) the Spirit of YHWH descended and shortly thereafter three thousand Messianic Believes experienced renewed life, YHWH adding back that which was lost at Sinai. The Feast of Shavuot and its link with Pentecost should now have much greater meaning for us as Messianic Believers.



LeClerc
Kernewek

Re: Feast of Firstfruits

[quote="LeClerc:81990"]Morning Bro

Kernewek wrote:
Quote:
Just wondering if the spiritual aspect is likened more to the Festival of Weeks where the physical is likened more to the Feast of firstfruits Leviticus 23,v15


15 “‘From the day after the Sabbath, the day you brought the sheaf of the wave offering, count off seven full weeks. 16 Count off fifty days up to the day after the seventh Sabbath, and then present an offering of new grain to YHWH.

Quote:
Thankyou LeClerc

Iwill reread Leviticus and pray on the matter, because I've not really considerd this before.

Kernewek


Found this bro.

The Book of Ruth paints a beautiful portrait of the truth of Shavuot. Y’shua is our Kinsman-Redeemer. Yahudi by birth and non Yahudi by birth are condemned and separated from YHWH by our sin (Isa. 59:1-2). Y’shua was willing and able to save us, being YHWH God. But He had to become our Kinsman to meet all three requirements. That He did when He became a man. Through His redemption, Yahudi by birth and non Yahudi by birth are placed together in the body of Israel, partakers of the covenants by the Kippur or covering of the blood of Y’shua the Messiah (Eph. 2). Ruth (Not a Yahudi by Birth) and Boaz (a Yahudi by birth) became one in marriage (Gen. 2:24). Yahudi and non Yahudi become one in Israel by grace through faith in the shed blood of Y’shua, With the Book of Ruth being required reading on Shavuot, what better picture could be given of Messianic Believers?

Moshe gave Israel the Law; Y’shua brought us grace and truth and the power to obey YHWH’s Law, life lived by the Spirit of YHWH (2 Cor. 3). S

Shavuot came, the Law was given, and shortly thereafter three thousand people died. At Shavuot (Pentecost) the Spirit of YHWH descended and shortly thereafter three thousand Messianic Believes experienced renewed life, YHWH adding back that which was lost at Sinai. The Feast of Shavuot and its link with Pentecost should now have much greater meaning for us as Messianic Believers.



LeClerc


Hi LeClerc
As I have already said I have given Vayikra 23,v15-22  (Leviticus) a great deal of thought lately, and I think  that I’ve come to the conclusion that YHWH gave certain specific instructions to the people of Isra’el , so that all other nations would know that Isra’el  was YHWHs chosen people and also to strengthen  their identity, for in unity there is strength. And looking at todays situation in the middle east there doesn't  seem to be any one stronger than Isra'el.  
Mind you that is only my opinion
LeClerc

Re: Feast of Firstfruits

Hi Kernewek

[quote="Kernewek:82185"]
LeClerc wrote:
Morning Bro

Kernewek wrote:
Quote:
Just wondering if the spiritual aspect is likened more to the Festival of Weeks where the physical is likened more to the Feast of firstfruits Leviticus 23,v15


15 “‘From the day after the Sabbath, the day you brought the sheaf of the wave offering, count off seven full weeks. 16 Count off fifty days up to the day after the seventh Sabbath, and then present an offering of new grain to YHWH.

Quote:
Thankyou LeClerc

Iwill reread Leviticus and pray on the matter, because I've not really considerd this before.

Kernewek


Found this bro.

The Book of Ruth paints a beautiful portrait of the truth of Shavuot. Y’shua is our Kinsman-Redeemer. Yahudi by birth and non Yahudi by birth are condemned and separated from YHWH by our sin (Isa. 59:1-2). Y’shua was willing and able to save us, being YHWH God. But He had to become our Kinsman to meet all three requirements. That He did when He became a man. Through His redemption, Yahudi by birth and non Yahudi by birth are placed together in the body of Israel, partakers of the covenants by the Kippur or covering of the blood of Y’shua the Messiah (Eph. 2). Ruth (Not a Yahudi by Birth) and Boaz (a Yahudi by birth) became one in marriage (Gen. 2:24). Yahudi and non Yahudi become one in Israel by grace through faith in the shed blood of Y’shua, With the Book of Ruth being required reading on Shavuot, what better picture could be given of Messianic Believers?

Moshe gave Israel the Law; Y’shua brought us grace and truth and the power to obey YHWH’s Law, life lived by the Spirit of YHWH (2 Cor. 3). S

Shavuot came, the Law was given, and shortly thereafter three thousand people died. At Shavuot (Pentecost) the Spirit of YHWH descended and shortly thereafter three thousand Messianic Believes experienced renewed life, YHWH adding back that which was lost at Sinai. The Feast of Shavuot and its link with Pentecost should now have much greater meaning for us as Messianic Believers.



LeClerc


Hi LeClerc
As I have already said I have given Vayikra 23,v15-22  (Leviticus) a great deal of thought lately, and I think  that I’ve come to the conclusion that YHWH gave certain specific instructions to the people of Isra’el , so that all other nations would know that Isra’el  was YHWHs chosen people and also to strengthen  their identity, for in unity there is strength. And looking at todays situation in the middle east there doesn't  seem to be any one stronger than Isra'el.  
Mind you that is only my opinion


Zechariah 12
YHWH, who stretches out the heavens, who lays the foundation of the earth, and who forms the human spirit within a person, declares: 2 “I am going to make Jerusalem a cup that sends all the surrounding peoples reeling. Judah will be besieged as well as Jerusalem. 3 On that day, when all the nations of the earth are gathered against her, I will make Jerusalem an immovable rock for all the nations. All who try to move it will injure themselves.

LeClerc
Kernewek

Hi LeClerc Bro

Iwill say AMEN to that

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