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LeClerc

Jehovahís Witnesses and the Memorial of Christís Death

Hi all.

If you have had an invite to the Memorial from visiting JW's this link explains what will be taking place in Kingdom Halls around the world at sunset on the 14 April 2014.

Jehovahís Witnesses and the Memorial of Christís Death

Regards

LeClerc
Jim

Re: Jehovahís Witnesses and the Memorial of Christís Death

LeClerc wrote:
Hi all.

If you have had an invite to the Memorial from visiting JW's this link explains what will be taking place in Kingdom Halls around the world at sunset on the 14 April 2014.

Jehovahís Witnesses and the Memorial of Christís Death  



Yes.
I've always thought this was a travesty of what the Lord commanded us to do in the act of communion. Not only that, but an INSULT to the sacrifice He made for us.
Thanks for posting it, LeClerc.
There have been times when I have felt unworthy of partaking of the Elements...but, then, is ANYONE worthy?
Surely the whole point of Jesus sacrifice was that, by it, we are all saved by the grace of Him who died and rose for us.
The only condition is our acceptance of who He is and what He has done for us, and the act of communion is a commemorative act, in which we renew that acceotance in our thoughts and prayers.

Regards

LeClerc
LeClerc

Hi Jim

Thousands of JW's around the world are waking up to The Truth about The Truth

There is another post here

http://www.jwstruggle.com/2014/01...ng-the-jehovahs-witness-religion/

which you might like to read.

Regards

LeClerc
Jim

LeClerc wrote:
Hi Jim

Thousands of JW's around the world are waking up to The Truth about The Truth

There is another post here

http://www.jwstruggle.com/2014/01...ng-the-jehovahs-witness-religion/

which you might like to read.



Again, thanks.
I've noticed that, when one confronts a JW with the abundant deceptions, discrepencies, diversions, flip-flops, contradictions, etc, in the sect, their response is, in the main, not to defend them or even argue the point, but to dream up a scripture which is at best semi-relevent, and at worst dragged wholly out of context, to 'defend' a position which has been shown in their own literature and turgid history to be at best, untenable, and at worst, farcical.
That's why I simply won't play their game: they enjoy tying people in knots of their own devising, which bear no relevence to the Christian life.
That is why, also, that I am sometimes over-combattive when debating with them in an effort to get them into a place where they can seriously examine the origins and motivation of their founders and governin body, showing that it is simply a house built on sand.

Regards

LeClerc
LeClerc

Hi Jim

I fully understand what you are saying Jim.

Here is another link regarding Baptism within the Watchtower Organisation.

http://www.jwstruggle.com/2013/08...ed-into-the-watchtower-or-christ/

Regards

LeClerc
Jim

LeClerc wrote:
Hi Jim

I fully understand what you are saying Jim.

Here is another link regarding Baptism within the Watchtower Organisation.

http://www.jwstruggle.com/2013/08...ed-into-the-watchtower-or-christ/

Regards

LeClerc
 



Strange indeed...and a very warped understanding of Scripture - even the mistranslation of scripture maskerading as such in the Kingdom halls.
They seem to take a perverse delight in taking virtually every aspect of Christian thought and distorting it into some preconceived agenda all their own.
How many times does Jesus, let alone Paul, James, Peter and John warn us against such false prophets in the Gospel and other NT writings?
Leonard James

Jim wrote:

How many times does Jesus, let alone Paul, James, Peter and John warn us against such false prophets in the Gospel and other NT writings?


Well, naturally! They were all perfectly well aware that other people would have different beliefs to their own, so tried to preempt them and slur them with the name "false prophets".

Sadly, it worked with the credulous!
Lexilogio

The idea of passing, but not partaking, of the bread and wine is fascinating. It suggests a psychological principle, an element of fear - ensuring people are aware they need to do more to become worthy. By that process, it aims to pull them further into the organisation. You see this principle at work in other cults (I define a cult as a religious organisation which causes harm to followers), the use of fear to bind people strongly to the organisation.

What is more sad is that I see some politicians do the same thing.
LeClerc

Morning Jim

Jim wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hi Jim

I fully understand what you are saying Jim.

Here is another link regarding Baptism within the Watchtower Organisation.

http://www.jwstruggle.com/2013/08...ed-into-the-watchtower-or-christ/

Regards

LeClerc




Strange indeed...and a very warped understanding of Scripture - even the mistranslation of scripture maskerading as such in the Kingdom halls.
They seem to take a perverse delight in taking virtually every aspect of Christian thought and distorting it into some preconceived agenda all their own.
How many times does Jesus, let alone Paul, James, Peter and John warn us against such false prophets in the Gospel and other NT writings?


Agree 100% Jim.

Those born of YHWH by grace through faith in The Messiah Y'shua have only ONE Lord and Master.

Jude
4 For certain individuals, the ones written about long ago as being meant for this condemnation, have wormed their way in ó ungodly people who pervert Godís grace into a license for debauchery and disown our only Master and Lord, Yeshua the Messiah.

If we turn to Exodus 23
17 Three times a year all your men are to appear before the Lord, YHWH.

The translators of the NWT have changed this to read

Exodus 23 NWT
17 †Three times a year all your men are to appear before the true Lord, Jehovah.

Inserting the word ''true'' thereby encouraging it's readers to disown our ONLY Lord and Master, Y'shua, The Logos Of YHWH, made flesh.

Regards

LeClerc
Jim

Lexilogio wrote:
The idea of passing, but not partaking, of the bread and wine is fascinating. It suggests a psychological principle, an element of fear - ensuring people are aware they need to do more to become worthy. By that process, it aims to pull them further into the organisation. You see this principle at work in other cults (I define a cult as a religious organisation which causes harm to followers), the use of fear to bind people strongly to the organisation.

What is more sad is that I see some politicians do the same thing.
   




The strange thing, though, Lexi, and one which I simply cannot unravel, is that those who DO partake of the elements in a memorial seem to consider themselves to be one of the 144,000 in the New Jerusalem...which, apart from a complete misunderstanding of the nature of John's revelation, is a misreading of Revelation itself, and a mark of extreme arrogance.
Jim

LeClerc wrote:
Morning Jim

Jim wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hi Jim

I fully understand what you are saying Jim.

Here is another link regarding Baptism within the Watchtower Organisation.

http://www.jwstruggle.com/2013/08...ed-into-the-watchtower-or-christ/

Regards

LeClerc
† †
Yes.
That's why, when I study the scriptures in detail, I do so using three or more translations (although, of course, not using the NWT!) Every translation, even with the best scholarship, can have an errorr within it - and given the shifting sands of English, I always hedge my bets.
However, blatant falsehoods such as the Exodus examples are conspicuous by their absence even in the 'loosest' of dynamic equivalent versions.

-


Strange indeed...and a very warped understanding of Scripture - even the mistranslation of scripture maskerading as such in the Kingdom halls.
They seem to take a perverse delight in taking virtually every aspect of Christian thought and distorting it into some preconceived agenda all their own.
How many times does Jesus, let alone Paul, James, Peter and John warn us against such false prophets in the Gospel and other NT writings?


Agree 100% Jim.

Those born of YHWH by grace through faith in The Messiah Y'shua have only ONE Lord and Master.

Jude
4 For certain individuals, the ones written about long ago as being meant for this condemnation, have wormed their way in ó ungodly people who pervert Godís grace into a license for debauchery and disown our only Master and Lord, Yeshua the Messiah.

If we turn to Exodus 23
17 Three times a year all your men are to appear before the Lord, YHWH.

The translators of the NWT have changed this to read

Exodus 23 NWT
17 †Three times a year all your men are to appear before the true Lord, Jehovah.

Inserting the word ''true'' thereby encouraging it's readers to disown our ONLY Lord and Master, Y'shua, The Logos Of YHWH, made flesh.

Regards

LeClerc
   


-
What concerns me is that, on conversing with a few local Witnesses, is that they are discouraged in using any but the NWT, and are positively warned against Bible study outside the reach of the WT.
It was the very study of Scripture without the overarching arm of a power-crazed church which led to the Reformation, and the rediscovery of the wonders of a personal relationship with God in Christ, through His atoning sacrifice.
Stifling such study is limiting the power of the Spirit (whom, of course, they singularly insult by failing to acknowledge His personhood in the NWT propoganda)
LeClerc

Hello Jim

Jim wrote:
Lexilogio wrote:
The idea of passing, but not partaking, of the bread and wine is fascinating. It suggests a psychological principle, an element of fear - ensuring people are aware they need to do more to become worthy. By that process, it aims to pull them further into the organisation. You see this principle at work in other cults (I define a cult as a religious organisation which causes harm to followers), the use of fear to bind people strongly to the organisation.

What is more sad is that I see some politicians do the same thing.
† †




The strange thing, though, Lexi, and one which I simply cannot unravel, is that those who DO partake of the elements in a memorial seem to consider themselves to be one of the 144,000 in the New Jerusalem...which, apart from a complete misunderstanding of the nature of John's revelation, is a misreading of Revelation itself, and a mark of extreme arrogance.


The other strange thing Jim, is that the number of those partaking was decreasing, now over the past few years the number is increasing and many are partaking in their homes away from the Kingdom Halls.

Regards

LeClerc
Jim

Sorry about my last post - I pushed enter too early.
I've edited it and lenghtened it a bit!
LeClerc

Hello James

Jim wrote:
Sorry about my last post - I pushed enter too early.
I've edited it and lenghtened it a bit!


Thats okay Jim.

From what you have posted, re the NWT, that is why the WTBTS stopped printing their Kingdom Interlinear because those who followed the WTBTS teaching started to question the translation of the NWT when compared to the original Greek.

They sort of scored an own goal with that one.

Not many Witnesses today even know there was a Kingdom Interlinear and when shown it are quite shocked.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/w...anslation-of-the-Greek-Scriptures

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

Luke 10:22
All things have been handed over to me by my Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, and no one knows who the Father is except the Son and anyone to whom the Son is willing to reveal him.

How many spirits does the Father have?


Jim

JamesJah wrote:
Luke 10:22
All things have been handed over to me by my Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, and no one knows who the Father is except the Son and anyone to whom the Son is willing to reveal him.

How many spirits does the Father have?


 



Irrelevent to the thread.
Please try again.
Lexilogio

JamesJah wrote:
Luke 10:22
All things have been handed over to me by my Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, and no one knows who the Father is except the Son and anyone to whom the Son is willing to reveal him.

How many spirits does the Father have?




One wonders if you are capable of reading what others post? Or is selective blindness a pre-requiste of joining the JW's?

Have you never thought that God is able to stand up to scrutiny and debate? That religions which truly follow him can be openly discussed and are then found to meet the principles Jesus taught?

Perhaps not. Never mind. There is an awful lot of sand in the world for people to stick their head in.
Lexilogio

JamesJah wrote:
Luke 10:22
All things have been handed over to me by my Father, and no one knows who the Son is except the Father, and no one knows who the Father is except the Son and anyone to whom the Son is willing to reveal him.

How many spirits does the Father have?




One wonders if you are capable of reading what others post? Or is selective blindess a pre-requiste of joining the JW's?

Have you never thought that God is able to stand up to scrutiny and debate? That religions which truly follow him can be openly discussed and are then found to meet the principles Jesus taught?

Perhaps not. Never mind. There is an awful lot of sand in the world for people to stick their head in.
JamesJah

Who laid down his life for man,

The Father or the Son?

gone

More JW claptrap!
Jim

Yep...and more JW failure to anser a point.
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
Who laid down his life for man,

The Father or the Son?



The Logos who became flesh.

Now James who is The Logos according to the Kingdom Interlinear ?

Regards

LeClerc
Jim

Don't divert James from squirming over the unscriptural approach to both the elements and baptism, LeClerc: you know he's just dying to defend the WTBTS sect's doctrine (assuming it hasn't changed again in the last few hours, which, given its' track record, is a very distinct possibility.)
LeClerc

Hi Jim

Jim wrote:
Don't divert James from squirming over the unscriptural approach to both the elements and baptism, LeClerc: you know he's just dying to defend the WTBTS sect's doctrine (assuming it hasn't changed again in the last few hours, which, given its' track record, is a very distinct possibility.)


Thank you for those very wise words Jim will repost some of my earlier posts just to remind James.

Regards

LeClerc
LeClerc

Hi Jim

I fully understand what you are saying Jim.

Here is another link regarding Baptism within the Watchtower Organisation.

http://www.jwstruggle.com/2013/08...ed-into-the-watchtower-or-christ/

Regards

LeClerc
LeClerc

Hello Jim

Jim wrote:
Sorry about my last post - I pushed enter too early.
I've edited it and lenghtened it a bit!


Thats okay Jim.

From what you have posted, re the NWT, that is why the WTBTS stopped printing their Kingdom Interlinear because those who followed the WTBTS teaching started to question the translation of the NWT when compared to the original Greek.

They sort of scored an own goal with that one.

Not many Witnesses today even know there was a Kingdom Interlinear and when shown it are quite shocked.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/w...anslation-of-the-Greek-Scriptures

Regards

LeClerc
Lexilogio

JamesJah wrote:
Who laid down his life for man,

The Father or the Son?



One wonders if you are capable of reading what others post? Or is selective blindess a pre-requiste of joining the JW's?

Have you never thought that God is able to stand up to scrutiny and debate? That religions which truly follow him can be openly discussed and are then found to meet the principles Jesus taught?

Perhaps not. Never mind. There is an awful lot of sand in the world for people to stick their head in.
_________________
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello Jim

Jim wrote:
Sorry about my last post - I pushed enter too early.
I've edited it and lenghtened it a bit!


Thats okay Jim.

From what you have posted, re the NWT, that is why the WTBTS stopped printing their Kingdom Interlinear because those who followed the WTBTS teaching started to question the translation of the NWT when compared to the original Greek.

They sort of scored an own goal with that one.

Not many Witnesses today even know there was a Kingdom Interlinear and when shown it are quite shocked.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/w...anslation-of-the-Greek-Scriptures

Regards

LeClerc


I still have one, I also have a bible in French, German,  Italian, and Chinese.

If I need some other language I can go to wt.org So how is the mutual back slapping society doing these days?

Have you learnt where the vowels go in Hebrew yet Leclerc?

And which edge of the page you read from?
Jim

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello Jim

Jim wrote:
Sorry about my last post - I pushed enter too early.
I've edited it and lenghtened it a bit!


Thats okay Jim.

From what you have posted, re the NWT, that is why the WTBTS stopped printing their Kingdom Interlinear because those who followed the WTBTS teaching started to question the translation of the NWT when compared to the original Greek.

They sort of scored an own goal with that one.

Not many Witnesses today even know there was a Kingdom Interlinear and when shown it are quite shocked.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/w...anslation-of-the-Greek-Scriptures

Regards

LeClerc


I still have one, I also have a bible in French, German, †Italian, and Chinese.

If I need some other language I can go to wt.org So how is the mutual back slapping society doing these days?

Have you learnt where the vowels go in Hebrew yet Leclerc?

And which edge of the page you read from?
 


Diversion from thread noted.
Again.
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello Jim

Jim wrote:
Sorry about my last post - I pushed enter too early.
I've edited it and lenghtened it a bit!


Thats okay Jim.

From what you have posted, re the NWT, that is why the WTBTS stopped printing their Kingdom Interlinear because those who followed the WTBTS teaching started to question the translation of the NWT when compared to the original Greek.

They sort of scored an own goal with that one.

Not many Witnesses today even know there was a Kingdom Interlinear and when shown it are quite shocked.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/w...anslation-of-the-Greek-Scriptures

Regards

LeClerc


I still have one, I also have a bible in French, German, †Italian, and Chinese.



Which Kingdom Interlinear do you have James, the 1969 version or the 1985 version ?

When you have answered this question maybe we could begin to have a look inside.

Regards

LeClerc
Jim

Why bother?
One rotten apple is just like another!
LeClerc

Morning Jim

Jim wrote:
Why bother?
One rotten apple is just like another!


Because it's not the Greek text which is rotten only the WTBTS translation of the Greek texts.

With their interlinear it can easliy be shown how the translators have corrupted the Greek text.

They have the English words under the Greek words then use a completly different English word in their actual translation.

For example

John 8 verse 58

Interlinear reads I am

The NWT reads I have been

and

John 14 verse 14

Interlinear reads

if anything you should ask me in the name of me this I sahall do.

The NWT reads if you ask anything in my name I will do it.

Regards

LeClerc
Jim

Sorry: I meant "Why bother, because the KIT in either version is as corrupt as the NWT"
I had a copy which I gave to a friend who is competent in Koine, having lectured in Koine at St Andrews University.
To be fair, he looked long and hard at the volume, and, after a three week assessment, suggested that it might, at a push, be used to prop up a bird bath in his garden, in which case the effort in doctoring the Greek, and then printing the book, would not have been entirely in vain!
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello Jim

Jim wrote:
Sorry about my last post - I pushed enter too early.
I've edited it and lenghtened it a bit!


Thats okay Jim.

From what you have posted, re the NWT, that is why the WTBTS stopped printing their Kingdom Interlinear because those who followed the WTBTS teaching started to question the translation of the NWT when compared to the original Greek.

They sort of scored an own goal with that one.

Not many Witnesses today even know there was a Kingdom Interlinear and when shown it are quite shocked.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/w...anslation-of-the-Greek-Scriptures

Regards

LeClerc


I still have one, I also have a bible in French, German, †Italian, and Chinese.



Which Kingdom Interlinear do you have James, the 1969 version or the 1985 version ?

When you have answered this question maybe we could begin to have a look inside.

Regards

LeClerc


Why did Jehovah use Abraham as an illustration of future events he would be performing?
gone

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello Jim

Jim wrote:
Sorry about my last post - I pushed enter too early.
I've edited it and lenghtened it a bit!


Thats okay Jim.

From what you have posted, re the NWT, that is why the WTBTS stopped printing their Kingdom Interlinear because those who followed the WTBTS teaching started to question the translation of the NWT when compared to the original Greek.

They sort of scored an own goal with that one.

Not many Witnesses today even know there was a Kingdom Interlinear and when shown it are quite shocked.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/w...anslation-of-the-Greek-Scriptures

Regards

LeClerc


I still have one, I also have a bible in French, German, †Italian, and Chinese.



Which Kingdom Interlinear do you have James, the 1969 version or the 1985 version ?

When you have answered this question maybe we could begin to have a look inside.

Regards

LeClerc


Why did Jehovah use Abraham as an illustration of future events he would be performing?


If the deity did it was because he was crazy. Encouraging someone to even consider sacrificing their child, let alone attempt to do so, was the act of a psychopath!
Jim

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello Jim

Jim wrote:
Sorry about my last post - I pushed enter too early.
I've edited it and lenghtened it a bit!


Thats okay Jim.

From what you have posted, re the NWT, that is why the WTBTS stopped printing their Kingdom Interlinear because those who followed the WTBTS teaching started to question the translation of the NWT when compared to the original Greek.

They sort of scored an own goal with that one.

Not many Witnesses today even know there was a Kingdom Interlinear and when shown it are quite shocked.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/w...anslation-of-the-Greek-Scriptures

Regards

LeClerc


I still have one, I also have a bible in French, German, †Italian, and Chinese.



Which Kingdom Interlinear do you have James, the 1969 version or the 1985 version ?

When you have answered this question maybe we could begin to have a look inside.

Regards

LeClerc


Why did Jehovah use Abraham as an illustration of future events he would be performing?
 




Evasion noted - again.
JamesJah

Jim wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello Jim

Jim wrote:
Sorry about my last post - I pushed enter too early.
I've edited it and lenghtened it a bit!


Thats okay Jim.

From what you have posted, re the NWT, that is why the WTBTS stopped printing their Kingdom Interlinear because those who followed the WTBTS teaching started to question the translation of the NWT when compared to the original Greek.

They sort of scored an own goal with that one.

Not many Witnesses today even know there was a Kingdom Interlinear and when shown it are quite shocked.

http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/w...anslation-of-the-Greek-Scriptures

Regards

LeClerc


I still have one, I also have a bible in French, German, †Italian, and Chinese.



Which Kingdom Interlinear do you have James, the 1969 version or the 1985 version ?

When you have answered this question maybe we could begin to have a look inside.

Regards

LeClerc


Why did Jehovah use Abraham as an illustration of future events he would be performing?





Evasion noted - again.


So why do you do it so often?
Jim

Evasion noted - again.
Please read the topic of the thread and the last post by LeClerc.
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Morning Jim

Jim wrote:
Why bother?
One rotten apple is just like another!


Because it's not the Greek text which is rotten only the WTBTS translation of the Greek texts.

With their interlinear it can easliy be shown how the translators have corrupted the Greek text.

They have the English words under the Greek words then use a completly different English word in their actual translation.

For example

John 8 verse 58

Interlinear reads I am

The NWT reads I have been

and

John 14 verse 14

Interlinear reads

if anything you should ask me in the name of me this I sahall do.

The NWT reads if you ask anything in my name I will do it.

Regards

LeClerc


So what has this to do with the memorial jim?
LeClerc

Re: Jehovahís Witnesses and the Memorial of Christís Death

Hi all.

If you have had an invite to the Memorial from visiting JW's this link explains what will be taking place in Kingdom Halls around the world at sunset on the 14 April 2014.

Jehovahís Witnesses and the Memorial of Christís Death

Just for you James.

Regards

LeClerc
Lexilogio

LeClerc wrote:
Morning Jim

Jim wrote:
Why bother?
One rotten apple is just like another!


Because it's not the Greek text which is rotten only the WTBTS translation of the Greek texts.

With their interlinear it can easliy be shown how the translators have corrupted the Greek text.

They have the English words under the Greek words then use a completly different English word in their actual translation.

For example

John 8 verse 58

Interlinear reads I am

The NWT reads I have been

and

John 14 verse 14

Interlinear reads

if anything you should ask me in the name of me this I sahall do.

The NWT reads if you ask anything in my name I will do it.

Regards

LeClerc



Hmmm
εἶπεν αὐτοῖς Ἰησοῦς Ἀμὴν ἀμὴν λέγω ὑμῖν, πρὶν Ἀβραὰμ γενέσθαι ἐγὼ εἰμί.

Ειπεν is past tense, you are correct, Le Clerc
JamesJah

Re: Jehovahís Witnesses and the Memorial of Christís Death

LeClerc wrote:
Hi all.

If you have had an invite to the Memorial from visiting JW's this link explains what will be taking place in Kingdom Halls around the world at sunset on the 14 April 2014.

Jehovahís Witnesses and the Memorial of Christís Death

Just for you James.

Regards

LeClerc



Who are the partakers at the meal?

What do the scriptures say?

1 Corinthians 11:27-30
Therefore, whoever eats the loaf or drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will be guilty respecting the body and the blood of the Lord. First let a man approve himself after scrutiny, and only then let him eat of the loaf and drink of the cup. For the one who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment against himself. That is why many among you are weak and sick, and quite a few are sleeping in death.


Who spoke to Moses in the dessert?
Jim

Lexilogio wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning Jim

Jim wrote:
Why bother?
One rotten apple is just like another!


Because it's not the Greek text which is rotten only the WTBTS translation of the Greek texts.

With their interlinear it can easliy be shown how the translators have corrupted the Greek text.

They have the English words under the Greek words then use a completly different English word in their actual translation.

For example

John 8 verse 58

Interlinear reads I am

The NWT reads I have been

and

John 14 verse 14

Interlinear reads

if anything you should ask me in the name of me this I sahall do.

The NWT reads if you ask anything in my name I will do it.

Regards

LeClerc



Hmmm
εἶπεν αὐτοῖς Ἰησοῦς Ἀμὴν ἀμὴν λέγω ὑμῖν, πρὶν Ἀβραὰμ γενέσθαι ἐγὼ εἰμί.

Ειπεν is past tense, you are correct, Le Clerc
 


This is where I envy you, Lexi!
It takes me back to studying NT Greek at Glasgow Uni. I wish I could access it again, but, as the song goes "If wishes were fishes/ We'd cast nets in the sea. (Eric Bogle)
Anyhoo, When I had the oppoortunity to talk with Profs Lorimer and Prof emeratus Barclay, I remember the atmosphere going disticnctly chilly when the subject of the KIT surfaced.
Barclay had already been disgracefully misquoted by the WT as endorsing the NWT - a fact for which the disreputable dregs in Brooklyn have not yet apologidsed, so much for 'truth' in their dismal sect.
Barclay was vehemently antagonistic to the KIT, saying that after thirty five pages, he gave up counting the falsehoods inserted in the thing, while Lorimer made the aforementioned statement regarding its' usefulness as a prop for a bird bath, if nothing else!
JamesJah

Sounds like some real intellectual jargon being banded about, I wonder if they have convinced themselves they know what they are talking about?

Is it still a problem being accepted in UMI if you think evolution is rubbish?

Have they discovered yet why all the gigantic animals are in the sea but none are left on the land?



Jim

JamesJah wrote:
Sounds like some real intellectual jargon being banded about, I wonder if they have convinced themselves they know what they are talking about?

Is it still a problem being accepted in UMI if you think evolution is rubbish?

Have they discovered yet why all the gigantic animals are in the sea but none are left on the land?



   


Nope.
Unlike the anonymous mistranslators of the NWT, James, Professors Lorimer and Barclay were experts in the New Testament in general, and New Testament Greek in particular.
JamesJah

Jim wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
Sounds like some real intellectual jargon being banded about, I wonder if they have convinced themselves they know what they are talking about?

Is it still a problem being accepted in UMI if you think evolution is rubbish?

Have they discovered yet why all the gigantic animals are in the sea but none are left on the land?



† †


Nope.
Unlike the anonymous mistranslators of the NWT, James, Professors Lorimer and Barclay were experts in the New Testament in general, and New Testament Greek in particular.


Translations speak for themselves that is why people choose those that are faithful to the original manuscripts rather than the ones hard to read and have spurious text inserted in them.

Translations not faithful to the original text have been produced by named translators but it has not made those translation in any way reliable now has it?

The DV and the KJV are two of the most corrupt translations, so where is your reliable translation produced by experts?
Jim

JamesJah wrote:
Jim wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
Sounds like some real intellectual jargon being banded about, I wonder if they have convinced themselves they know what they are talking about?

Is it still a problem being accepted in UMI if you think evolution is rubbish?

Have they discovered yet why all the gigantic animals are in the sea but none are left on the land?



† †


Nope.
Unlike the anonymous mistranslators of the NWT, James, Professors Lorimer and Barclay were experts in the New Testament in general, and New Testament Greek in particular.


Translations speak for themselves that is why people choose those that are faithful to the original manuscripts rather than the ones hard to read and have spurious text inserted in them. †


-

That rules out the NWT on all counts, then.
Thanks.
-

Translations not faithful to the original text have been produced by named translators but it has not made those translation in any way reliable now has it? †

-
At least we have the names and qualifications, and linguistic ethos of the translators to work with...unlike the shameful mistranslators who, probably out of embarrassment, chose to withold their names from the dire NWT.
-


The DV and the KJV are two of the most corrupt translations, so where is your reliable translation produced by experts?


-
I don't use either. However, even those are ten times better than the deceiver's manual from Brooklyn. The WT diched the AV in favour of their own, corrupted biased travesty - showing their predeliction for deception.
As a matter of fact, I don't stick with one particular version. I vary depending on the circumstances. When I'm studying the Scriptures in depth, I use both word-for-word and dynamic equivalent translations simultaneously, thus I would normsally have a combination of NIV (2011 version) NRSV, NLT and CEV handy.

All translations endorsed by Biblica, who will not endorse a version which has not been rigorously scrutinised by a team of multi-denominational experts in the field.
For pleasure, I read the Lorimer New Testament in Scots, translated from Koine into classic Scots by the aforementioned Professor Lorimer.
JamesJah

Jim wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
Jim wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
Sounds like some real intellectual jargon being banded about, I wonder if they have convinced themselves they know what they are talking about?

Is it still a problem being accepted in UMI if you think evolution is rubbish?

Have they discovered yet why all the gigantic animals are in the sea but none are left on the land?



† †


Nope.
Unlike the anonymous mistranslators of the NWT, James, Professors Lorimer and Barclay were experts in the New Testament in general, and New Testament Greek in particular.


Translations speak for themselves that is why people choose those that are faithful to the original manuscripts rather than the ones hard to read and have spurious text inserted in them. †


-

That rules out the NWT on all counts, then.
Thanks.
-

Translations not faithful to the original text have been produced by named translators but it has not made those translation in any way reliable now has it? †

-
At least we have the names and qualifications, and linguistic ethos of the translators to work with...unlike the shameful mistranslators who, probably out of embarrassment, chose to withold their names from the dire NWT.
-


The DV and the KJV are two of the most corrupt translations, so where is your reliable translation produced by experts?


-
I don't use either. However, even those are ten times better than the deceiver's manual from Brooklyn. The WT diched the AV in favour of their own, corrupted biased travesty - showing their predeliction for deception.
As a matter of fact, I don't stick with one particular version. I vary depending on the circumstances. When I'm studying the Scriptures in depth, I use both word-for-word and dynamic equivalent translations simultaneously, thus I would normsally have a combination of NIV (2011 version) NRSV, NLT and CEV handy.

All translations endorsed by Biblica, who will not endorse a version which has not been rigorously scrutinised by a team of multi-denominational experts in the field.
For pleasure, I read the Lorimer New Testament in Scots, translated from Koine into classic Scots by the aforementioned Professor Lorimer.


I have read most translations and do not find any that are really suitable for the United Kingdom English, Which is just sad for English children needing to read something that portrays their language correctly.

My Flavious Josephus work is in 1702 English that is quite a struggle to read until you get used to it, but it is still regarded as one of the best translations of its time.

Unlike you I found the WT very helpful when they reprinted the Benjamin Wilson Diaglot, I have found it a real asset in teaching scripture to people who love the truth of God's word.

I have never understood why modern translators are so afraid of using #Almighty God's name.

Then most formal religions have some crazy ideas about the God they worship and most go crazy if you show them the truth.

The worst ones are the Muslim's if you teach the bible in Jordan they will stick you in prison for being a Zionist.

Yet the Muslim's Koran has two extreme contradictions.

In one place it sais it is impossible for Allah to have a son, when in another place it sais all things are possible with Allah.


Then that is not uncommon in formal religions is it?
Jim

Well, since I couldn't give a fig for the "United Kingdom" or, indeed, its' English language, James, your first sentence is irrelevent.
Whether you or I like a particular version of Scripture is irrelevent.
The shifting sands of language are in constant flux. What matters is the accurate transmision of the original texts into a language which is both true to those texts and accessable to readers.
Modern versions of Scripture are well versed in both.
Even the New English Bible - a scholarly dignified version which I nevertheless find stultifying in its' language, is accurate given the MSS available.
Most new translations are made by a series of committees whose members are drawn from many Christian denominations and strands of thought (to try to eliminate denominational bia) with each team having at least two thirds of its members fully conversant in Biblical languages.
The "reviewing teams" which finally approve the version have, by their nature, to be composed of experts in Greek, Armaic, linguistics and, of course, modern English.
Only after these exhaustive reviews have taken place is the version given to Biblica - who then review the whole thing again.
This can take a matter of twelve years from start to finish. The result, though, can be seen as as accurate as possible, even if the style of language might not be what the reader is used to.

Any translation which has not undergone this exhaustive process should be treated with extreme caution and, in my view,  as equal with non-canonical works at best, or abandoned at worst.
I will not use a version translated by a particular denomination without outside input. Such a version is bound to show the bias of the group who translate it.
JamesJah

Jim wrote:
Well, since I couldn't give a fig for the "United Kingdom" or, indeed, its' English language, James, your first sentence is irrelevent.
Whether you or I like a particular version of Scripture is irrelevent.
The shifting sands of language are in constant flux. What matters is the accurate transmision of the original texts into a language which is both true to those texts and accessable to readers.
Modern versions of Scripture are well versed in both.
Even the New English Bible - a scholarly dignified version which I nevertheless find stultifying in its' language, is accurate given the MSS available.
Most new translations are made by a series of committees whose members are drawn from many Christian denominations and strands of thought (to try to eliminate denominational bia) with each team having at least two thirds of its members fully conversant in Biblical languages.
The "reviewing teams" which finally approve the version have, by their nature, to be composed of experts in Greek, Armaic, linguistics and, of course, modern English.
Only after these exhaustive reviews have taken place is the version given to Biblica - who then review the whole thing again.
This can take a matter of twelve years from start to finish. The result, though, can be seen as as accurate as possible, even if the style of language might not be what the reader is used to.

Any translation which has not undergone this exhaustive process should be treated with extreme caution and, in my view, †as equal with non-canonical works at best, or abandoned at worst.
I will not use a version translated by a particular denomination without outside input. Such a version is bound to show the bias of the group who translate it.


Nobody was in the least bit bothered about the correctness of translation until the early bible students in America had a go at striating out some of the horrendous errors, which made them quite popular as you well know, do you not?

So now we know what happens to the dead, what the Kingdom means, and who is about to rule over the earth and bring peace to mankind, something that would not have happened if we had waited on the popular church to do, is that not the case?
Jim

Sorry.
You are in error.
Many Bible scholars started getting worried about the accuracy of the AV when the Sinatica and Vizae codices appeared, showing the errors in the translation.
That's when a movement for more accurate versions really started, not only in America, but London, Glasgow, Sydney, Berlin and Rome.
With the unearthing of earlier MSS and parts of MSS, the accuracy of the Scripture can be enhanced, as, for example, with the newer translations of the OT benefitting from the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

Again, any version whose translators cannot be assessed as to their abilities, or which is commissioned by one particular sect or denomination, should be treated with great caution, and, unless it has had input and review from those outside the organisation, deemed unfit for use in church settings or Christian gatherings.
Even the excellent Jerusalem and New Jerusalem translations, commissioned by the Roman Catholic Church, was translated by a series of committes which had Anglicans, a Methodist, three Presbyterians and a Rabbi among their number.

Can you say the same of the NWT?
If not, it should be rejected as a translation on the grounds of bias, before even opening the front cover to check for accuracy.
JamesJah

Jim wrote:
Sorry.
You are in error.
Many Bible scholars started getting worried about the accuracy of the AV when the Sinatica and Vizae codices appeared, showing the errors in the translation.
That's when a movement for more accurate versions really started, not only in America, but London, Glasgow, Sydney, Berlin and Rome.
With the unearthing of earlier MSS and parts of MSS, the accuracy of the Scripture can be enhanced, as, for example, with the newer translations of the OT benefitting from the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

Again, any version whose translators cannot be assessed as to their abilities, or which is commissioned by one particular sect or denomination, should be treated with great caution, and, unless it has had input and review from those outside the organisation, deemed unfit for use in church settings or Christian gatherings.
Even the excellent Jerusalem and New Jerusalem translations, commissioned by the Roman Catholic Church, was translated by a series of committes which had Anglicans, a Methodist, three Presbyterians and a Rabbi among their number.

Can you say the same of the NWT?
If not, it should be rejected as a translation on the grounds of bias, before even opening the front cover to check for accuracy.


Can not say it is not most definitely biased especially when it comes to the doctrines that should never have entered the Christian teaching in the first place.

But there is one thing most people miss about JW's is that they will use any bible that suits the person they are talking to, the reason most have a misconception about them,  is because they have listened to opponents that are trying to prevent the Good News being spread world wide.

What did Jesus say about the Good News?

Matthew 24:14
this good news of the Kingdom will be preached in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.
gone

Define 'Good News'.
JamesJah

It is good news for those who have been looking forward to a peaceful world, it is only bad news for those who like the world the way it is.
gone

Hmmmmmmmm!
Jim

JamesJah wrote:
Jim wrote:
Sorry.
You are in error.
Many Bible scholars started getting worried about the accuracy of the AV when the Sinatica and Vizae codices appeared, showing the errors in the translation.
That's when a movement for more accurate versions really started, not only in America, but London, Glasgow, Sydney, Berlin and Rome.
With the unearthing of earlier MSS and parts of MSS, the accuracy of the Scripture can be enhanced, as, for example, with the newer translations of the OT benefitting from the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

Again, any version whose translators cannot be assessed as to their abilities, or which is commissioned by one particular sect or denomination, should be treated with great caution, and, unless it has had input and review from those outside the organisation, deemed unfit for use in church settings or Christian gatherings.
Even the excellent Jerusalem and New Jerusalem translations, commissioned by the Roman Catholic Church, was translated by a series of committes which had Anglicans, a Methodist, three Presbyterians and a Rabbi among their number.

Can you say the same of the NWT?
If not, it should be rejected as a translation on the grounds of bias, before even opening the front cover to check for accuracy.


Can not say it is not most definitely biased especially when it comes to the doctrines that should never have entered the Christian teaching in the first place.  


-
Evidence of bias straight away.
-

But there is one thing most people miss about JW's is that they will use any bible that suits the person they are talking to, the reason most have a misconception about them, †is because they have listened to opponents that are trying to prevent the Good News being spread world wide.  
-
Strange, that.
'cos any time JWs come to my place, ythey insist on using the NWT. When I offer them a better version (any better version, which, to be honest, wouldn't be that difficult), they politely refuse.
-


What did Jesus say about the Good News?

Matthew 24:14
this good news of the Kingdom will be preached in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.


-
Yep.
But not from corrupt, deliberately mistranslated versions, it won't.
JamesJah

Jim wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
Jim wrote:
Sorry.
You are in error.
Many Bible scholars started getting worried about the accuracy of the AV when the Sinatica and Vizae codices appeared, showing the errors in the translation.
That's when a movement for more accurate versions really started, not only in America, but London, Glasgow, Sydney, Berlin and Rome.
With the unearthing of earlier MSS and parts of MSS, the accuracy of the Scripture can be enhanced, as, for example, with the newer translations of the OT benefitting from the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls.

Again, any version whose translators cannot be assessed as to their abilities, or which is commissioned by one particular sect or denomination, should be treated with great caution, and, unless it has had input and review from those outside the organisation, deemed unfit for use in church settings or Christian gatherings.
Even the excellent Jerusalem and New Jerusalem translations, commissioned by the Roman Catholic Church, was translated by a series of committes which had Anglicans, a Methodist, three Presbyterians and a Rabbi among their number.

Can you say the same of the NWT?
If not, it should be rejected as a translation on the grounds of bias, before even opening the front cover to check for accuracy.


Can not say it is not most definitely biased especially when it comes to the doctrines that should never have entered the Christian teaching in the first place. †


-
Evidence of bias straight away.
-

But there is one thing most people miss about JW's is that they will use any bible that suits the person they are talking to, the reason most have a misconception about them, †is because they have listened to opponents that are trying to prevent the Good News being spread world wide. †
-
Strange, that.
'cos any time JWs come to my place, ythey insist on using the NWT. When I offer them a better version (any better version, which, to be honest, wouldn't be that difficult), they politely refuse.
-


What did Jesus say about the Good News?

Matthew 24:14
this good news of the Kingdom will be preached in all the inhabited earth for a witness to all the nations, and then the end will come.


-
Yep.
But not from corrupt, deliberately mistranslated versions, it won't.


Quite a broad statement can you quote some references?
Jim

I've quoted enough sites on this board, to none of which you have responded, showing the deceit and manipulation, misquoting and poor translation which went with the territory of the NWT.
Why should I go to the trouble of posting them again, when you will blithely ignore them as per usual?
JamesJah

Jim wrote:
I've quoted enough sites on this board, to none of which you have responded, showing the deceit and manipulation, misquoting and poor translation which went with the territory of the NWT.
Why should I go to the trouble of posting them again, when you will blithely ignore them as per usual?


Here is where the discussion is is it not?

Here is where some make grandiose assertions of no value what so ever do they not?


Here is where the obvious prejudice of some can be openly exposed can it not?

So which teach for the benefit of the people and which preach to store up wealth?

Matthew 10:7-9
As you go, preach, saying: ĎThe Kingdom of the heavens has drawn near.í 8 Cure the sick, raise up the dead, make lepers clean, expel demons. You received free, give free.
JamesJah

Who where the ones that had Jesus executed for blasphemy?

Who keep blaming the Romans for his execution.

Who is the real killers of the prophets?



Jim

Diversionary tactic alert.
JamesJah

Weed Christians accept what is expedient to what is socially acceptable.





DO ALL ROADS LEAD YO GOD???????
Jim

Which has precisely WHAT to do with either the /P or the translation/mistranslation of Scriptures?

(I'd agree that 'weed' Christians would indeed swallow any old codswallop - such as the NWT - were it force fed to them, as is the case in the WTBTS)
JamesJah

Weed Christians arrived on the scene long before the NWT.

Planted by the Devil to distort the teachings of the Christ for the polluted teaching of Babylon, so that now we have the Harlot riding the wild beast Babylon the Great mother of all the Harlots.



Click to see full size image
Jim

Your attempts to deviate from the substance of the thread spek volumes for the sect you represent, James.
JamesJah

Some weed Christians were creating problems at some memorial celebrations long before the NWT.

1 Corinthians 11:18, 19
For first of all, I hear that when you come together in a congregation, divisions exist among you; and to an extent I believe it. For there will certainly also be sects among you, so that those of you who are approved may also become evidence

1 Corinthians 11:20-22
When you come together in one place, it is not really to eat the Lordís Evening Meal. For when you eat it, each one takes his own evening meal beforehand, so that one is hungry but another is intoxicated.

 Do you not have houses for eating and drinking? Or do you despise the congregation of God and make those who have nothing feel ashamed? What can I say to you? Should I commend you? In this

I do not commend you.
Jim

Yep.
Read it.
So what exactly does this have to do with the JW perversion of Communion?
JamesJah

Who invented communion?
Jim

JamesJah wrote:
Who invented communion?

Evasion noted.
Lexilogio

Re: Jehovahís Witnesses and the Memorial of Christís Death

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hi all.

If you have had an invite to the Memorial from visiting JW's this link explains what will be taking place in Kingdom Halls around the world at sunset on the 14 April 2014.

Jehovahís Witnesses and the Memorial of Christís Death

Just for you James.

Regards

LeClerc



Who are the partakers at the meal?

What do the scriptures say?

1 Corinthians 11:27-30
Therefore, whoever eats the loaf or drinks the cup of the Lord unworthily will be guilty respecting the body and the blood of the Lord. First let a man approve himself after scrutiny, and only then let him eat of the loaf and drink of the cup. For the one who eats and drinks without discerning the body eats and drinks judgment against himself. That is why many among you are weak and sick, and quite a few are sleeping in death.


Who spoke to Moses in the dessert?


One wonders if you are capable of reading what others post? Or is selective blindess a pre-requiste of joining the JW's?

Have you never thought that God is able to stand up to scrutiny and debate? That religions which truly follow him can be openly discussed and are then found to meet the principles Jesus taught?

Perhaps not. Never mind. There is an awful lot of sand in the world for people to stick their head in.
Lexilogio

JamesJah wrote:
Sounds like some real intellectual jargon being banded about, I wonder if they have convinced themselves they know what they are talking about?

Is it still a problem being accepted in UMI if you think evolution is rubbish?

Have they discovered yet why all the gigantic animals are in the sea but none are left on the land?





So you think that the Bible in its original language is "intellectual jargon". That says an awful lot about the JW's.
JamesJah

It is usually a surprise to most that the bible explains itself you just have to know where to look for the answers.



http://h2g2.com/entry/A36459462
Lexilogio

JamesJah wrote:
It is usually a surprise to most that the bible explains itself you just have to know where to look for the answers.



http://h2g2.com/entry/A36459462


Yes, it explains itself. Even easier when you read it in the original language.
JamesJah

2 Timothy 4:1-5
I solemnly charge you before God and Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by his manifestation and his Kingdom:

Preach the word; be at it urgently in favorable times and difficult times; reprove, reprimand, exhort, with all patience and art of teaching.

For there will be a period of time when they will not put up with the wholesome teaching, but according to their own desires, they will surround themselves with teachers to have their ears tickled.

They will turn away from listening to the truth and give attention to false stories.

You, though, keep your senses in all things, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelizer, fully accomplish your ministry.
Jim

JamesJah wrote:
2 Timothy 4:1-5
I solemnly charge you before God and Christ Jesus, who is to judge the living and the dead, and by his manifestation and his Kingdom:

Preach the word; be at it urgently in favorable times and difficult times; reprove, reprimand, exhort, with all patience and art of teaching.

For there will be a period of time when they will not put up with the wholesome teaching, but according to their own desires, they will surround themselves with teachers to have their ears tickled.

They will turn away from listening to the truth and give attention to false stories.

You, though, keep your senses in all things, endure hardship, do the work of an evangelizer, fully accomplish your ministry.


-
Nice text.
Diddly squat to do with the mistranslation of Scriptures by the WTBS, or, indeed, their blatant misinterpretation of the Communion service, whether transubstantiation or not.

Par for the course, though.
JamesJah

This one has little to do with it either.

2 Timothy 3:8-10 & 13
Now in the way that Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these also go on opposing the truth. Such men are completely corrupted in mind, disapproved as regards the faith.

Nevertheless, they will make no further progress, for their folly will be very plain to all, as it was with those two men.

. In fact, all those desiring to live with godly devotion in association with Christ Jesus will also be persecuted. But wicked men and impostors will advance from bad to worse, misleading and being misled.
Jim

JamesJah wrote:
This one has little to do with it either.

2 Timothy 3:8-10 & 13
Now in the way that Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these also go on opposing the truth. Such men are completely corrupted in mind, disapproved as regards the faith.

Nevertheless, they will make no further progress, for their folly will be very plain to all, as it was with those two men.

. In fact, all those desiring to live with godly devotion in association with Christ Jesus will also be persecuted. But wicked men and impostors will advance from bad to worse, misleading and being misled.



-
Describes those who set out to deceive the velievers to a tee, James...deceivers such as those who deliberately mistranslate Scripture and announce false parousias, for example.

Ring any bells?
JamesJah

Jim wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
This one has little to do with it either.

2 Timothy 3:8-10 & 13
Now in the way that Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these also go on opposing the truth. Such men are completely corrupted in mind, disapproved as regards the faith.

Nevertheless, they will make no further progress, for their folly will be very plain to all, as it was with those two men.

. In fact, all those desiring to live with godly devotion in association with Christ Jesus will also be persecuted. But wicked men and impostors will advance from bad to worse, misleading and being misled.



-
Describes those who set out to deceive the velievers to a tee, James...deceivers such as those who deliberately mistranslate Scripture and announce false parousias, for example.

Ring any bells?


When was the last time any one noticed Jesus presence?

The sheep and the goats are as blind to Jesus presence are they not?
JamesJah

JamesJah wrote:
It is usually a surprise to most that the bible explains itself you just have to know where to look for the answers.



http://h2g2.com/entry/A36459462


Have most Christians been corrupted by man made religions men in funny hats and strange types of dresses?

Magic practising priests waving magic sticks at the people with water in them?

Are they still on the backs of politicians?
gone

And what about the corrupt JW garbage?
Jim

JamesJah wrote:
Jim wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
This one has little to do with it either.

2 Timothy 3:8-10 & 13
Now in the way that Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these also go on opposing the truth. Such men are completely corrupted in mind, disapproved as regards the faith.

Nevertheless, they will make no further progress, for their folly will be very plain to all, as it was with those two men.

. In fact, all those desiring to live with godly devotion in association with Christ Jesus will also be persecuted. But wicked men and impostors will advance from bad to worse, misleading and being misled.



-
Describes those who set out to deceive the velievers to a tee, James...deceivers such as those who deliberately mistranslate Scripture and announce false parousias, for example.

Ring any bells?


When was the last time any one noticed Jesus presence?

The sheep and the goats are as blind to Jesus presence are they not?
 



Evasion noted - as per usual.
Jim

JamesJah wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
It is usually a surprise to most that the bible explains itself you just have to know where to look for the answers.



http://h2g2.com/entry/A36459462


Have most Christians been corrupted by man made religions men in funny hats and strange types of dresses?

Magic practising priests waving magic sticks at the people with water in them?

Are they still on the backs of politicians?


-
No.
JamesJah

The intelligent ones know they are foolish, it is only the foolish that think they are wise.
Jim

JamesJah wrote:
The intelligent ones know they are foolish, it is only the foolish that think they are wise.
 


-----which is still irrelevent to the thread.
As per usual.
JamesJah

When did we see you???????????????



Leonard James

Jim wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
The intelligent ones know they are foolish, it is only the foolish that think they are wise.



-----which is still irrelevent to the thread.
As per usual.


And means nothing to anybody with any intelligence.
Sebastian Toe

JamesJah wrote:
The intelligent ones know they are foolish, it is only the foolish that think they are wise.


Which one do you associate yourself with then James?

Are you intelligent but know you are foolish?
or
are you foolish but think you are wise?
gone

Sebastian Toe wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
The intelligent ones know they are foolish, it is only the foolish that think they are wise.


Which one do you associate yourself with then James?

Are you intelligent but know you are foolish?
or
are you foolish but think you are wise?


Oh well that is ok then I know I am foolish/senile!
JamesJah

Afternoon all are any of you intelligent to know when this scripture came about?

Revelation 1:7
Look! He is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, and those who pierced him; and all the tribes of the earth will beat themselves in grief because of him.




Click to see full size image
gone

JamesJah wrote:
Afternoon all are any of you intelligent to know when this scripture came about?

Revelation 1:7
Look! He is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, and those who pierced him; and all the tribes of the earth will beat themselves in grief because of him.




Click to see full size image



Are you?
cyberman

JamesJah wrote:
Afternoon all are any of you intelligent to know when this scripture came about?

 


Do you honestly think that agreement or otherwise with your interpretation of that bit of the Bible can serve as a straightforward measure of intelligence?
JMC

Sebastian Toe wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
The intelligent ones know they are foolish, it is only the foolish that think they are wise.


Which one do you associate yourself with then James?

Are you intelligent but know you are foolish?
or
are you foolish but think you are wise?


Ah, yes, the old "prickly pear" of being proud, or feigning humility and being proud all the same:

ďThe sun shines on all alike, and vainglory beams on all activities. For instance, I am vainglorious when I fast; and when I relax the fast in order to be unnoticed, I am again vainglorious over my prudence. When well-dressed I am quite overcome by vainglory, and when I put on poor clothes I am vainglorious again. When I talk I am defeated, and when I am silent I am again defeated by it. However I throw this prickly-pear, a spike stands upright.Ē
- St John Climacus
Jim

JamesJah wrote:
Afternoon all are any of you intelligent to know when this scripture came about?

Revelation 1:7
Look! He is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, and those who pierced him; and all the tribes of the earth will beat themselves in grief because of him.

-

This has nothing to do with the thread.
Either stick to the themes of the thread or start another, please.
Diversionary tactics are not helpful.




Click to see full size image
Sebastian Toe

JamesJah wrote:
Afternoon all are any of you intelligent to know when this scripture came about?

Revelation 1:7
Look! He is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, and those who pierced him; and all the tribes of the earth will beat themselves in grief because of him.


Are you foolish enough to say that you know for sure?
JamesJah

Floo wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
Afternoon all are any of you intelligent to know when this scripture came about?

Revelation 1:7
Look! He is coming with the clouds, and every eye will see him, and those who pierced him; and all the tribes of the earth will beat themselves in grief because of him.




Click to see full size image



Are you?


Me I am only smart enough to pick other peoples brains  but I hope I am smart enough to pick only the good bits???????

gone

It is a matter of which brains you pick, you aren't smart if you only pick the ones spouting the JW garbage!
Ketty

JamesJah wrote:
Floo wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
Afternoon all are any of you intelligent to know when this scripture came about?


Are you?


Me I am only smart enough to pick other peoples brains†but I hope I am smart enough to pick only the good bits?


What's intelligence got to do with it?  What's smart about picking other people's brains and what's the measure for 'the good bits'?  Why does that need a   ?
JamesJah

Floo wrote:
It is a matter of which brains you pick, you aren't smart if you only pick the ones spouting the JW garbage!


A lot more there than there is here is there not?

Good job I have other sources' than this forum is it not?

I check all religious chatter with what the bible teaches cant go wrong doing that as it was written by the smartest one in the universe.
JamesJah

Ketty wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
Floo wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
Afternoon all are any of you intelligent to know when this scripture came about?


Are you?


Me I am only smart enough to pick other peoples brains†but I hope I am smart enough to pick only the good bits?


What's intelligence got to do with it? †What's smart about picking other people's brains and what's the measure for 'the good bits'? †Why does that need a † ?


Where did all your knowledge come from "O" wise one??
LeClerc

Hi all

Elder from Poland story

Regards

LeClerc

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