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JamesJah

What make an apostate?

How does one recognise an apostate with so many religions to oppose?

Which is the true religion which one can apostatise?
Rose

Re: What make an apostate?

JamesJah wrote:
How does one recognise an apostate with so many religions to oppose?

Which is the true religion which one can apostatise?


Quote:


adjective
1.
abandoning a religious or political belief or principle.
"an apostate Roman Catholic"



I used to go to church every Sunday, not any more.

I guess that makes me an apostate!



Julie
Leonard James

Re: What make an apostate?

JamesJah wrote:
How does one recognise an apostate with so many religions to oppose?


Everybody is an apostate of some sort. Atheists are the only total apostates.

Quote:
Which is the true religion which one can apostatise?


There is isn't one.
JamesJah

There must be some distinction as the Catholics burnt many at the stake for the crime of apostasy, most times for translating the bible to show people what God really did require of them.
Sebastian Toe

JamesJah wrote:
There must be some distinction as the Catholics burnt many at the stake for the crime of apostasy, most times for translating the bible to show people what God really did require of them.

Have you got something against Catholics, James?
Jim

Sebastian Toe wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
There must be some distinction as the Catholics burnt many at the stake for the crime of apostasy, most times for translating the bible to show people what God really did require of them.

Have you got something against Catholics, James?



That's an understatement.

They/we eat black puddings.
bnabernard

Jim wrote:
Sebastian Toe wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
There must be some distinction as the Catholics burnt many at the stake for the crime of apostasy, most times for translating the bible to show people what God really did require of them.

Have you got something against Catholics, James?



That's an understatement.

They/we eat black puddings.


Further afield they drai blood from cattle and mix it with maize as a staple diet.

bernard (hug)
LeClerc

Re: What make an apostate?

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
How does one recognise an apostate with so many religions to oppose?

Which is the true religion which one can apostatise?


Maybe we could begin with you posting the verses from the New World Translation ( sorry Jim ) which contain the word ''apostate''.

Thanks

LeClerc
JamesJah

Re: What make an apostate?

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
How does one recognise an apostate with so many religions to oppose?

Which is the true religion which one can apostatise?


Maybe we could begin with you posting the verses from the New World Translation ( sorry Jim ) which contain the word ''apostate''.

Thanks

LeClerc


Proverbs 11:9
By his mouth the apostate brings his neighbour to ruin, But by knowledge the righteous are rescued.

{spelling correction to English of American English neoghbor{

Isaiah 10:6
I will send him against an apostate nation, Against the people who infuriated me; I will command him to take much spoil and much plunder And to trample them like mud in the streets.

*** nwt Jeremiah 16:6 ***
Pagan mourning customs apparently practiced in apostate Israel
++
Jim

Re: What make an apostate?

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
How does one recognise an apostate with so many religions to oppose?

Which is the true religion which one can apostatise?


Maybe we could begin with you posting the verses from the New World Translation ( sorry Jim ) which contain the word ''apostate''.

Thanks

LeClerc


Proverbs 11:9
By his mouth the apostate brings his neighbour to ruin, But by knowledge the righteous are rescued.

{spelling correction to English of American English neoghbor{

Isaiah 10:6
I will send him against an apostate nation, Against the people who infuriated me; I will command him to take much spoil and much plunder And to trample them like mud in the streets.

*** nwt Jeremiah 16:6 ***
Pagan mourning customs apparently practiced in apostate Israel
++
 


Does Apostate mean frequently giving the date for false parousias  which is specifically against Christ's command?
JamesJah

Re: What make an apostate?

Jim wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
How does one recognise an apostate with so many religions to oppose?

Which is the true religion which one can apostatise?


Maybe we could begin with you posting the verses from the New World Translation ( sorry Jim ) which contain the word ''apostate''.

Thanks

LeClerc


Proverbs 11:9
By his mouth the apostate brings his neighbour to ruin, But by knowledge the righteous are rescued.

{spelling correction to English of American English neoghbor{

Isaiah 10:6
I will send him against an apostate nation, Against the people who infuriated me; I will command him to take much spoil and much plunder And to trample them like mud in the streets.

*** nwt Jeremiah 16:6 ***
Pagan mourning customs apparently practiced in apostate Israel
++
 


Does Apostate mean frequently giving the date for false parousias  which is specifically against Christ's command?


Are you still making the mistake that Jesus is not present?

Something that the sheep and goat's are having a problem with even now.

Mathew 25: 31 onwards >>> When  did we see you? will be the cry will it not?
Jim

Re: What make an apostate?

JamesJah wrote:
Jim wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
How does one recognise an apostate with so many religions to oppose?

Which is the true religion which one can apostatise?


Maybe we could begin with you posting the verses from the New World Translation ( sorry Jim ) which contain the word ''apostate''.

Thanks

LeClerc


Proverbs 11:9
By his mouth the apostate brings his neighbour to ruin, But by knowledge the righteous are rescued.

{spelling correction to English of American English neoghbor{

Isaiah 10:6
I will send him against an apostate nation, Against the people who infuriated me; I will command him to take much spoil and much plunder And to trample them like mud in the streets.

*** nwt Jeremiah 16:6 ***
Pagan mourning customs apparently practiced in apostate Israel
++
 


Does Apostate mean frequently giving the date for false parousias  which is specifically against Christ's command?


Are you still making the mistake that Jesus is not present?

Something that the sheep and goat's are having a problem with even now.

Mathew 25: 31 onwards >>> When  did we see you? will be the cry will it not?
 


That'll be an "I'm not going to answer 'cos it's embarassing ", then?
JamesJah

Re: What make an apostate?

Jim wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
Jim wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
How does one recognise an apostate with so many religions to oppose?

Which is the true religion which one can apostatise?


Maybe we could begin with you posting the verses from the New World Translation ( sorry Jim ) which contain the word ''apostate''.

Thanks

LeClerc


Proverbs 11:9
By his mouth the apostate brings his neighbour to ruin, But by knowledge the righteous are rescued.

{spelling correction to English of American English neoghbor{

Isaiah 10:6
I will send him against an apostate nation, Against the people who infuriated me; I will command him to take much spoil and much plunder And to trample them like mud in the streets.

*** nwt Jeremiah 16:6 ***
Pagan mourning customs apparently practiced in apostate Israel
++
 


Does Apostate mean frequently giving the date for false parousias  which is specifically against Christ's command?


Are you still making the mistake that Jesus is not present?

Something that the sheep and goat's are having a problem with even now.

Mathew 25: 31 onwards >>> When  did we see you? will be the cry will it not?
 


That'll be an "I'm not going to answer 'cos it's embarassing ", then?


Going around spreading lies about a person deliberately when he knows what is true I would think comes close to apostasy.

expecting ones master to come sooner than he does has little to do with anything much.
Jim

Wot...lies about Jesus coming back in
1870
1875
1914
1925
1970
1975

etc, etc, etc?

Agreed.
LeClerc

Re: What make an apostate?

Afternoon James

Hope you are enjoying the sunshine.

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
How does one recognise an apostate with so many religions to oppose?

Which is the true religion which one can apostatise?


Maybe we could begin with you posting the verses from the New World Translation ( sorry Jim ) which contain the word ''apostate''.

Thanks

LeClerc


Proverbs 11:9
By his mouth the apostate brings his neighbour to ruin, But by knowledge the righteous are rescued.

{spelling correction to English of American English neoghbor{

Isaiah 10:6
I will send him against an apostate nation, Against the people who infuriated me; I will command him to take much spoil and much plunder And to trample them like mud in the streets.

*** nwt Jeremiah 16:6 ***
Pagan mourning customs apparently practiced in apostate Israel
++


Thank you James

Those verse are from the Tanakh, which I believe you refer to as the Hebrew scriptures.

Now can you please post verses from the New Word Translation (sorry Jim ) of the Greek scriptures, ie the Messianic Writings which contain the word ''apostate''

Thank You

LeClerc
JamesJah

Re: What make an apostate?

LeClerc wrote:
Afternoon James

Hope you are enjoying the sunshine.

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
How does one recognise an apostate with so many religions to oppose?

Which is the true religion which one can apostatise?


Maybe we could begin with you posting the verses from the New World Translation ( sorry Jim ) which contain the word ''apostate''.

Thanks

LeClerc


Proverbs 11:9
By his mouth the apostate brings his neighbour to ruin, But by knowledge the righteous are rescued.

{spelling correction to English of American English neoghbor{

Isaiah 10:6
I will send him against an apostate nation, Against the people who infuriated me; I will command him to take much spoil and much plunder And to trample them like mud in the streets.

*** nwt Jeremiah 16:6 ***
Pagan mourning customs apparently practiced in apostate Israel
++


Thank you James

Those verse are from the Tanakh, which I believe you refer to as the Hebrew scriptures.

Now can you please post verses from the New Word Translation (sorry Jim ) of the Greek scriptures, ie the Messianic Writings which contain the word ''apostate''

Thank You

LeClerc


Acts 21:21
But they have heard it rumoured about you that you have been teaching all the Jews among the nations an apostasy from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or to follow the customary practices. 

2 Thessalonians 2:3-5
Let no one lead you astray in any way, because it will not come unless the apostasy comes first and the man of lawlessness gets revealed, the son of destruction. He stands in opposition and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he sits down in the temple of God, publicly showing himself to be a god. Do you not remember that when I was still with you, I used to tell you these things?

*** nwt p. 1693 Glossary ***
Apostasy. This term in Greek (a·postasia) comes from a verb literally meaning “to stand away from.” The noun has the sense of “desertion, abandonment, or rebellion.” In the Christian Greek Scriptures, “apostasy” is used primarily with regard to those who defect from true worship.—Pr 11:9; Ac 21:21; 2Th 2:3.
JamesJah

Jim wrote:
Wot...lies about Jesus coming back in
1870
1875
1914
1925
1970
1975

etc, etc, etc?

Agreed.


Still regurgitating the old rubbish you were indoctrinated with by those that opposes the bible students and their exposure of Christendom's false teachings?

You know a lot about pyramids do you know when this took place?


Judging by your dates you do not have a clue.

Revelation 12:7-10
war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels battled with the dragon, and the dragon and its angels battled but they did not prevail, nor was a place found for them any longer in heaven. So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devil and Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth; he was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him. I heard a loud voice in heaven say:

Now have come to pass the salvation and the power and the Kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ,
Jim

JamesJah wrote:
Jim wrote:
Wot...lies about Jesus coming back in
1870
1875
1914
1925
1970
1975

etc, etc, etc?

Agreed.


Still regurgitating the old rubbish you were indoctrinated with by those that opposes the bible students and their exposure of Christendom's false teachings?

You know a lot about pyramids do you know when this took place?


Judging by your dates you do not have a clue.

Revelation 12:7-10
war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels battled with the dragon, and the dragon and its angels battled but they did not prevail, nor was a place found for them any longer in heaven. So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devil and Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth; he was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him. I heard a loud voice in heaven say:

Now have come to pass the salvation and the power and the Kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ,




Evasion noted.
As usual.
JamesJah

Jim wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
Jim wrote:
Wot...lies about Jesus coming back in
1870
1875
1914
1925
1970
1975

etc, etc, etc?

Agreed.


Still regurgitating the old rubbish you were indoctrinated with by those that opposes the bible students and their exposure of Christendom's false teachings?

You know a lot about pyramids do you know when this took place?


Judging by your dates you do not have a clue.

Revelation 12:7-10
war broke out in heaven: Michael and his angels battled with the dragon, and the dragon and its angels battled but they did not prevail, nor was a place found for them any longer in heaven. So down the great dragon was hurled, the original serpent, the one called Devil and Satan, who is misleading the entire inhabited earth; he was hurled down to the earth, and his angels were hurled down with him. I heard a loud voice in heaven say:

Now have come to pass the salvation and the power and the Kingdom of our God and the authority of his Christ,




Evasion noted.
As usual.


I thought you did not know, it is just the same for those who listed those dates in the first place, they have not a clue either.

How about how many of the last plagues of the seven last plagues are there let to befall the earth. or are you hiding behind more evasion????

Revelation 15:1
I saw in heaven another sign, great and wonderful, seven angels with seven plagues. These are the last ones, because by means of them the anger of God is brought to a finish.
Jim

Don;t waste your time throwing scripture at me, James - especially from a discredited, corrupt mistranslation; I'm perfectly able to read Scripture for myself - and from acredited, reliable sources.
It's a nice try though - refusing to condemn those who blatantly rode roughshod over the very words of Christ himself and flung dates - sometimes down to the MONTH - when 'prophesy' would be fulfilled, only to be proven wrong and surrupticiously change their doctrine accordingly.

Thank God for those who read the garbage churned out by the recycling bin experts in Brooklyn and record the dupliicity, deceit, failure, lies and false prophesy of what must be the most dismal shower of antichrists in history.
JamesJah

Jim wrote:
Don;t waste your time throwing scripture at me, James - especially from a discredited, corrupt mistranslation; I'm perfectly able to read Scripture for myself - and from acredited, reliable sources.
It's a nice try though - refusing to condemn those who blatantly rode roughshod over the very words of Christ himself and flung dates - sometimes down to the MONTH - when 'prophesy' would be fulfilled, only to be proven wrong and surrupticiously change their doctrine accordingly.

Thank God for those who read the garbage churned out by the recycling bin experts in Brooklyn and record the dupliicity, deceit, failure, lies and false prophesy of what must be the most dismal shower of antichrists in history.


Is that you do not know just the same as the other critics?

As for throwing scripture I also know most critics hate scripture especially when it tells them something they do not like.

You are not posting to Russell or the old bible students you are posting to me a servant of the most high so pleas tell me which scripture you find I have miss applied?
Jim

JamesJah wrote:
Jim wrote:
Don;t waste your time throwing scripture at me, James - especially from a discredited, corrupt mistranslation; I'm perfectly able to read Scripture for myself - and from acredited, reliable sources.
It's a nice try though - refusing to condemn those who blatantly rode roughshod over the very words of Christ himself and flung dates - sometimes down to the MONTH - when 'prophesy' would be fulfilled, only to be proven wrong and surrupticiously change their doctrine accordingly.

Thank God for those who read the garbage churned out by the recycling bin experts in Brooklyn and record the dupliicity, deceit, failure, lies and false prophesy of what must be the most dismal shower of antichrists in history.


Is that you do not know just the same as the other critics?

As for throwing scripture I also know most critics hate scripture especially when it tells them something they do not like.

You are not posting to Russell or the old bible students you are posting to me a servant of the most high so pleas tell me which scripture you find I have miss applied?


As to which Scrippture?
It's a question of which translation, James.
And, sorry, but I will not accept anything coming from a sect which says it is OK to lie for Jesus - and, James, the WTBTS does so.
I love Scripture..but Scripture translated by known, expert linguists whose authority is acredited by recognised qualifications from an established school of learning.
LeClerc

Re: What make an apostate?

Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Afternoon James

Hope you are enjoying the sunshine.

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
How does one recognise an apostate with so many religions to oppose?

Which is the true religion which one can apostatise?


Maybe we could begin with you posting the verses from the New World Translation ( sorry Jim ) which contain the word ''apostate''.

Thanks

LeClerc


Proverbs 11:9
By his mouth the apostate brings his neighbour to ruin, But by knowledge the righteous are rescued.

{spelling correction to English of American English neoghbor{

Isaiah 10:6
I will send him against an apostate nation, Against the people who infuriated me; I will command him to take much spoil and much plunder And to trample them like mud in the streets.

*** nwt Jeremiah 16:6 ***
Pagan mourning customs apparently practiced in apostate Israel
++


Thank you James

Those verse are from the Tanakh, which I believe you refer to as the Hebrew scriptures.

Now can you please post verses from the New Word Translation (sorry Jim ) of the Greek scriptures, ie the Messianic Writings which contain the word ''apostate''

Thank You

LeClerc


Acts 21:21
But they have heard it rumoured about you that you have been teaching all the Jews among the nations an apostasy from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or to follow the customary practices. 

2 Thessalonians 2:3-5
Let no one lead you astray in any way, because it will not come unless the apostasy comes first and the man of lawlessness gets revealed, the son of destruction. He stands in opposition and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he sits down in the temple of God, publicly showing himself to be a god. Do you not remember that when I was still with you, I used to tell you these things?

*** nwt p. 1693 Glossary ***
Apostasy. This term in Greek (a·postasia) comes from a verb literally meaning “to stand away from.” The noun has the sense of “desertion, abandonment, or rebellion.” In the Christian Greek Scriptures, “apostasy” is used primarily with regard to those who defect from true worship.—Pr 11:9; Ac 21:21; 2Th 2:3.


Thank you James.

Now turning to Acts chapter 21 which you quoted.

Acts 21:21
But they have heard it rumoured about you that you have been teaching all the Jews among the nations an apostasy from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or to follow the customary practices.

Who was being accused of apostasy.

What was the nature of that apostasy.

Regards

LeClerc
bnabernard

Isa 10:32


As yet shall he remain at Nob that day: he shall shake his hand against the mount of the daughter of Zion, the hill of Jerusalem


bernard (hug)
JamesJah

[quote]

Who was being accused of apostasy.

What was the nature of that apostasy.

Regards

Leclerc

[/quote}

The apostle Pail because he was now Following the sect of the Nazarene and teaching that it was no longer under the traditions of the Jews.

That circumcision was no longer required for those joining that sect.  

Does that situation seem familiar to you?
LeClerc

Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
Quote:


Who was being accused of apostasy.

What was the nature of that apostasy.

Regards

Leclerc



The apostle Pail because he was now Following the sect of the Nazarene and teaching that it was no longer under the traditions of the Jews.

That circumcision was no longer required for those joining that sect.  

Does that situation seem familiar to you?


Acts 21
17  When we got to Jerusalem, the brothers welcomed us gladly.18  But on the following day Paul went in with us to James, and all the elders were present.19  And he greeted them and began giving a detailed account of the things God did among the nations through his ministry. 20  After hearing this, they began to glorify God, but they said to him: “You see, brother, how many thousands of believers there are among the Jews, and they are all zealous for the Law.  But they have heard it rumored about you that you have been teaching all the Jews among the nations an apostasy from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or to follow the customary practices.22  What, then, is to be done about it? They are certainly going to hear that you have arrived.23  So do what we tell you: We have four men who have put themselves under a vow.24  Take these men with you and cleanse yourself ceremonially together with them and take care of their expenses, so that they may have their heads shaved. Then everyone will know that there is nothing to the rumors they were told about you, but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

What did James and the other elders in Jerusalem instruct Paul to do and why ?

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
Quote:


Who was being accused of apostasy.

What was the nature of that apostasy.

Regards

Leclerc



The apostle Pail because he was now Following the sect of the Nazarene and teaching that it was no longer under the traditions of the Jews.

That circumcision was no longer required for those joining that sect.  

Does that situation seem familiar to you?


Acts 21
17  When we got to Jerusalem, the brothers welcomed us gladly.18  But on the following day Paul went in with us to James, and all the elders were present.19  And he greeted them and began giving a detailed account of the things God did among the nations through his ministry. 20  After hearing this, they began to glorify God, but they said to him: “You see, brother, how many thousands of believers there are among the Jews, and they are all zealous for the Law.  But they have heard it rumored about you that you have been teaching all the Jews among the nations an apostasy from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or to follow the customary practices.22  What, then, is to be done about it? They are certainly going to hear that you have arrived.23  So do what we tell you: We have four men who have put themselves under a vow.24  Take these men with you and cleanse yourself ceremonially together with them and take care of their expenses, so that they may have their heads shaved. Then everyone will know that there is nothing to the rumors they were told about you, but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

What did James and the other elders in Jerusalem instruct Paul to do and why ?

Regards

LeClerc


I think this scripture will help you better rather than prolong a lengthy interrogation.


1 Corinthians 9:19-23
For though I am free from all people, I have made myself the slave to all, so that I may gain as many people as possible.

 To the Jews I became as a Jew in order to gain Jews; to those under law I became as under law, though I myself am not under law, in order to gain those under law.

To those without law I became as without law, although I am not without law toward God but under law toward Christ, in order to gain those without law.

To the weak I became weak, in order to gain the weak. I have become all things to people of all sorts, so that I might by all possible means save some.

 But I do all things for the sake of the good news, in order to share it with others.
LeClerc

Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
Quote:


Who was being accused of apostasy.

What was the nature of that apostasy.

Regards

Leclerc



The apostle Pail because he was now Following the sect of the Nazarene and teaching that it was no longer under the traditions of the Jews.

That circumcision was no longer required for those joining that sect.  

Does that situation seem familiar to you?


Acts 21
17  When we got to Jerusalem, the brothers welcomed us gladly.18  But on the following day Paul went in with us to James, and all the elders were present.19  And he greeted them and began giving a detailed account of the things God did among the nations through his ministry. 20  After hearing this, they began to glorify God, but they said to him: “You see, brother, how many thousands of believers there are among the Jews, and they are all zealous for the Law.  But they have heard it rumored about you that you have been teaching all the Jews among the nations an apostasy from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or to follow the customary practices.22  What, then, is to be done about it? They are certainly going to hear that you have arrived.23  So do what we tell you: We have four men who have put themselves under a vow.24  Take these men with you and cleanse yourself ceremonially together with them and take care of their expenses, so that they may have their heads shaved. Then everyone will know that there is nothing to the rumors they were told about you, but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

What did James and the other elders in Jerusalem instruct Paul to do and why ?

Regards

LeClerc


I think this scripture will help you better rather than prolong a lengthy interrogation.


1 Corinthians 9:19-23
For though I am free from all people, I have made myself the slave to all, so that I may gain as many people as possible.

 To the Jews I became as a Jew in order to gain Jews; to those under law I became as under law, though I myself am not under law, in order to gain those under law.

To those without law I became as without law, although I am not without law toward God but under law toward Christ, in order to gain those without law.

To the weak I became weak, in order to gain the weak. I have become all things to people of all sorts, so that I might by all possible means save some.

 But I do all things for the sake of the good news, in order to share it with others.


So why did James and the elders in Jerusalem instruct Paul with the following words

Acts 21
24 but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

Were not James and the elders in Jerusalem keeping the Law ?

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
Quote:


Who was being accused of apostasy.

What was the nature of that apostasy.

Regards

Leclerc





The apostle Pail because he was now Following the sect of the Nazarene and teaching that it was no longer under the traditions of the Jews.

That circumcision was no longer required for those joining that sect.  

Does that situation seem familiar to you?


Acts 21
17  When we got to Jerusalem, the brothers welcomed us gladly.18  But on the following day Paul went in with us to James, and all the elders were present.19  And he greeted them and began giving a detailed account of the things God did among the nations through his ministry. 20  After hearing this, they began to glorify God, but they said to him: “You see, brother, how many thousands of believers there are among the Jews, and they are all zealous for the Law.  But they have heard it rumored about you that you have been teaching all the Jews among the nations an apostasy from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or to follow the customary practices.22  What, then, is to be done about it? They are certainly going to hear that you have arrived.23  So do what we tell you: We have four men who have put themselves under a vow.24  Take these men with you and cleanse yourself ceremonially together with them and take care of their expenses, so that they may have their heads shaved. Then everyone will know that there is nothing to the rumors they were told about you, but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

What did James and the other elders in Jerusalem instruct Paul to do and why ?

Regards

LeClerc


I think this scripture will help you better rather than prolong a lengthy interrogation.


1 Corinthians 9:19-23
For though I am free from all people, I have made myself the slave to all, so that I may gain as many people as possible.

 To the Jews I became as a Jew in order to gain Jews; to those under law I became as under law, though I myself am not under law, in order to gain those under law.

To those without law I became as without law, although I am not without law toward God but under law toward Christ, in order to gain those without law.

To the weak I became weak, in order to gain the weak. I have become all things to people of all sorts, so that I might by all possible means save some.

 But I do all things for the sake of the good news, in order to share it with others.


So why did James and the elders in Jerusalem instruct Paul with the following words

Acts 21
24 but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

Were not James and the elders in Jerusalem keeping the Law ?

Regards

LeClerc



If they had kept the law they would be as Christ was perfectly obedient to the Father and worthy of life.

So did they keep the law or not?

Are they under undeserved kindness or not?

Who Gave any law to the nations?

2 Corinthians 6:1
Working together with him, we also urge you not to accept the undeserved kindness of God and miss its purpose.

Galatians 2:20, 21
I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and handed himself over for me.

 I do not reject the undeserved kindness of God, for
if righteousness is through law, Christ actually died for nothing.
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
Quote:


Who was being accused of apostasy.

What was the nature of that apostasy.

Regards

Leclerc





The apostle Pail because he was now Following the sect of the Nazarene and teaching that it was no longer under the traditions of the Jews.

That circumcision was no longer required for those joining that sect.  

Does that situation seem familiar to you?


Acts 21
17  When we got to Jerusalem, the brothers welcomed us gladly.18  But on the following day Paul went in with us to James, and all the elders were present.19  And he greeted them and began giving a detailed account of the things God did among the nations through his ministry. 20  After hearing this, they began to glorify God, but they said to him: “You see, brother, how many thousands of believers there are among the Jews, and they are all zealous for the Law.  But they have heard it rumored about you that you have been teaching all the Jews among the nations an apostasy from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or to follow the customary practices.22  What, then, is to be done about it? They are certainly going to hear that you have arrived.23  So do what we tell you: We have four men who have put themselves under a vow.24  Take these men with you and cleanse yourself ceremonially together with them and take care of their expenses, so that they may have their heads shaved. Then everyone will know that there is nothing to the rumors they were told about you, but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

What did James and the other elders in Jerusalem instruct Paul to do and why ?

Regards

LeClerc


I think this scripture will help you better rather than prolong a lengthy interrogation.


1 Corinthians 9:19-23
For though I am free from all people, I have made myself the slave to all, so that I may gain as many people as possible.

 To the Jews I became as a Jew in order to gain Jews; to those under law I became as under law, though I myself am not under law, in order to gain those under law.

To those without law I became as without law, although I am not without law toward God but under law toward Christ, in order to gain those without law.

To the weak I became weak, in order to gain the weak. I have become all things to people of all sorts, so that I might by all possible means save some.

 But I do all things for the sake of the good news, in order to share it with others.


So why did James and the elders in Jerusalem instruct Paul with the following words

Acts 21
24 but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

Were not James and the elders in Jerusalem keeping the Law ?

Regards

LeClerc



If they had kept the law they would be as Christ was perfectly obedient to the Father and worthy of life.

So did they keep the law or not?

Are they under undeserved kindness or not?

Who Gave any law to the nations?

2 Corinthians 6:1
Working together with him, we also urge you not to accept the undeserved kindness of God and miss its purpose.

Galatians 2:20, 21
I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and handed himself over for me.

 I do not reject the undeserved kindness of God, for
if righteousness is through law, Christ actually died for nothing.


Much to discuss here James.

Firstly no one is saying righteousness is through Law, it is by grace we are saved through faith in Messiah Y'shua.

Secondly what were James and the elders words to Paul.

Acts 21
24 but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

Did they say that Paul was walking orderly and keeping the Law.

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
Quote:


Who was being accused of apostasy.

What was the nature of that apostasy.

Regards

Leclerc





The apostle Pail because he was now Following the sect of the Nazarene and teaching that it was no longer under the traditions of the Jews.

That circumcision was no longer required for those joining that sect.  

Does that situation seem familiar to you?


Acts 21
17  When we got to Jerusalem, the brothers welcomed us gladly.18  But on the following day Paul went in with us to James, and all the elders were present.19  And he greeted them and began giving a detailed account of the things God did among the nations through his ministry. 20  After hearing this, they began to glorify God, but they said to him: “You see, brother, how many thousands of believers there are among the Jews, and they are all zealous for the Law.  But they have heard it rumored about you that you have been teaching all the Jews among the nations an apostasy from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or to follow the customary practices.22  What, then, is to be done about it? They are certainly going to hear that you have arrived.23  So do what we tell you: We have four men who have put themselves under a vow.24  Take these men with you and cleanse yourself ceremonially together with them and take care of their expenses, so that they may have their heads shaved. Then everyone will know that there is nothing to the rumors they were told about you, but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

What did James and the other elders in Jerusalem instruct Paul to do and why ?

Regards

LeClerc


I think this scripture will help you better rather than prolong a lengthy interrogation.


1 Corinthians 9:19-23
For though I am free from all people, I have made myself the slave to all, so that I may gain as many people as possible.

 To the Jews I became as a Jew in order to gain Jews; to those under law I became as under law, though I myself am not under law, in order to gain those under law.

To those without law I became as without law, although I am not without law toward God but under law toward Christ, in order to gain those without law.

To the weak I became weak, in order to gain the weak. I have become all things to people of all sorts, so that I might by all possible means save some.

 But I do all things for the sake of the good news, in order to share it with others.


So why did James and the elders in Jerusalem instruct Paul with the following words

Acts 21
24 but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

Were not James and the elders in Jerusalem keeping the Law ?

Regards

LeClerc



If they had kept the law they would be as Christ was perfectly obedient to the Father and worthy of life.

So did they keep the law or not?

Are they under undeserved kindness or not?

Who Gave any law to the nations?

2 Corinthians 6:1
Working together with him, we also urge you not to accept the undeserved kindness of God and miss its purpose.

Galatians 2:20, 21
I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and handed himself over for me.

 I do not reject the undeserved kindness of God, for
if righteousness is through law, Christ actually died for nothing.


Much to discuss here James.

Firstly no one is saying righteousness is through Law, it is by grace we are saved through faith in Messiah Y'shua.

Secondly what were James and the elders words to Paul.

Acts 21
24 but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

Did they say that Paul was walking orderly and keeping the Law.

Regards

LeClerc


O! SURPRISE, surprise they do, do they not??

Now what does this scripture say???\/


Romans 7:4-6
So, my brothers, you also were made dead to the Law through the body of the Christ, that you might become another’s, the one who was raised up from the dead, so that we should bear fruit to God. 5 For when we were living according to the flesh, the sinful passions that were awakened by the Law were at work in our bodies to produce fruit for death. 6 But now we have been released from the Law, because we have died to that which restrained us, in order that we might be slaves in a new sense by the spirit and not in the old sense by the written code.

(Romans 7:21-25
I find, then, this law in my case: When I wish to do what is right, what is bad is present with me. I really delight in the law of God according to the man I am within,

 but I see in my body another law warring against the law of my mind and leading me captive to sin’s law that is in my body.

Miserable man that I am! Who will rescue me from the body undergoing this death?

Thanks to God through Jesus Christ our Lord! So, then, with my mind I myself am a slave to God’s law, but with my flesh to sin’s law.



You might like to read the verses in-between if you are still having a problem.
LeClerc

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
Quote:


Who was being accused of apostasy.

What was the nature of that apostasy.

Regards

Leclerc





The apostle Pail because he was now Following the sect of the Nazarene and teaching that it was no longer under the traditions of the Jews.

That circumcision was no longer required for those joining that sect.  

Does that situation seem familiar to you?


Acts 21
17  When we got to Jerusalem, the brothers welcomed us gladly.18  But on the following day Paul went in with us to James, and all the elders were present.19  And he greeted them and began giving a detailed account of the things God did among the nations through his ministry. 20  After hearing this, they began to glorify God, but they said to him: “You see, brother, how many thousands of believers there are among the Jews, and they are all zealous for the Law.  But they have heard it rumored about you that you have been teaching all the Jews among the nations an apostasy from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or to follow the customary practices.22  What, then, is to be done about it? They are certainly going to hear that you have arrived.23  So do what we tell you: We have four men who have put themselves under a vow.24  Take these men with you and cleanse yourself ceremonially together with them and take care of their expenses, so that they may have their heads shaved. Then everyone will know that there is nothing to the rumors they were told about you, but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

What did James and the other elders in Jerusalem instruct Paul to do and why ?

Regards

LeClerc


I think this scripture will help you better rather than prolong a lengthy interrogation.


1 Corinthians 9:19-23
For though I am free from all people, I have made myself the slave to all, so that I may gain as many people as possible.

 To the Jews I became as a Jew in order to gain Jews; to those under law I became as under law, though I myself am not under law, in order to gain those under law.

To those without law I became as without law, although I am not without law toward God but under law toward Christ, in order to gain those without law.

To the weak I became weak, in order to gain the weak. I have become all things to people of all sorts, so that I might by all possible means save some.

 But I do all things for the sake of the good news, in order to share it with others.


So why did James and the elders in Jerusalem instruct Paul with the following words

Acts 21
24 but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

Were not James and the elders in Jerusalem keeping the Law ?

Regards

LeClerc



If they had kept the law they would be as Christ was perfectly obedient to the Father and worthy of life.

So did they keep the law or not?

Are they under undeserved kindness or not?

Who Gave any law to the nations?

2 Corinthians 6:1
Working together with him, we also urge you not to accept the undeserved kindness of God and miss its purpose.

Galatians 2:20, 21
I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and handed himself over for me.

 I do not reject the undeserved kindness of God, for
if righteousness is through law, Christ actually died for nothing.


Much to discuss here James.

Firstly no one is saying righteousness is through Law, it is by grace we are saved through faith in Messiah Y'shua.

Secondly what were James and the elders words to Paul.

Acts 21
24 but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

Did they say that Paul was walking orderly and keeping the Law.

Regards

LeClerc


O! SURPRISE, surprise they do, do they not??



Thank you James.

Now maybe we can move on the the second passage where the word apostasy occurs

2 Thessalonians 2:3-5
Let no one lead you astray in any way, because it will not come unless the apostasy comes first and the man of lawlessness gets revealed, the son of destruction. He stands in opposition and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he sits down in the temple of God, publicly showing himself to be a god. Do you not remember that when I was still with you, I used to tell you these things?

Now comparing with

Matthew 7 NWT
23  And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!

In the above passages, which are quoted from your NWT, please define lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
Quote:


Who was being accused of apostasy.

What was the nature of that apostasy.

Regards

Leclerc





The apostle Pail because he was now Following the sect of the Nazarene and teaching that it was no longer under the traditions of the Jews.

That circumcision was no longer required for those joining that sect.  

Does that situation seem familiar to you?


Acts 21
17  When we got to Jerusalem, the brothers welcomed us gladly.18  But on the following day Paul went in with us to James, and all the elders were present.19  And he greeted them and began giving a detailed account of the things God did among the nations through his ministry. 20  After hearing this, they began to glorify God, but they said to him: “You see, brother, how many thousands of believers there are among the Jews, and they are all zealous for the Law.  But they have heard it rumored about you that you have been teaching all the Jews among the nations an apostasy from Moses, telling them not to circumcise their children or to follow the customary practices.22  What, then, is to be done about it? They are certainly going to hear that you have arrived.23  So do what we tell you: We have four men who have put themselves under a vow.24  Take these men with you and cleanse yourself ceremonially together with them and take care of their expenses, so that they may have their heads shaved. Then everyone will know that there is nothing to the rumors they were told about you, but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

What did James and the other elders in Jerusalem instruct Paul to do and why ?

Regards

LeClerc


I think this scripture will help you better rather than prolong a lengthy interrogation.


1 Corinthians 9:19-23
For though I am free from all people, I have made myself the slave to all, so that I may gain as many people as possible.

 To the Jews I became as a Jew in order to gain Jews; to those under law I became as under law, though I myself am not under law, in order to gain those under law.

To those without law I became as without law, although I am not without law toward God but under law toward Christ, in order to gain those without law.

To the weak I became weak, in order to gain the weak. I have become all things to people of all sorts, so that I might by all possible means save some.

 But I do all things for the sake of the good news, in order to share it with others.


So why did James and the elders in Jerusalem instruct Paul with the following words

Acts 21
24 but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

Were not James and the elders in Jerusalem keeping the Law ?

Regards

LeClerc



If they had kept the law they would be as Christ was perfectly obedient to the Father and worthy of life.

So did they keep the law or not?

Are they under undeserved kindness or not?

Who Gave any law to the nations?

2 Corinthians 6:1
Working together with him, we also urge you not to accept the undeserved kindness of God and miss its purpose.

Galatians 2:20, 21
I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and handed himself over for me.

 I do not reject the undeserved kindness of God, for
if righteousness is through law, Christ actually died for nothing.


Much to discuss here James.

Firstly no one is saying righteousness is through Law, it is by grace we are saved through faith in Messiah Y'shua.

Secondly what were James and the elders words to Paul.

Acts 21
24 but that you are walking orderly and you are also keeping the Law

Did they say that Paul was walking orderly and keeping the Law.

Regards

LeClerc


O! SURPRISE, surprise they do, do they not??



Thank you James.

Now maybe we can move on the the second passage where the word apostasy occurs

2 Thessalonians 2:3-5
Let no one lead you astray in any way, because it will not come unless the apostasy comes first and the man of lawlessness gets revealed, the son of destruction. He stands in opposition and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he sits down in the temple of God, publicly showing himself to be a god. Do you not remember that when I was still with you, I used to tell you these things?

Now comparing with

Matthew 7 NWT
23  And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness!

In the above passages, which are quoted from your NWT, please define lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc


In this case it is their lack of obedience to the Good news and the failure to do the will of the Almighty God for our day?

Most Religions not only do not do God's will but have no knowledge of what it should be.

Matthew 7:21-23
Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens,

but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will.


Many will say to me in that day: ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?’ And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness. . .
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:


In this case it is their lack of obedience to the Good news and the failure to do the will of the Almighty God for our day?

Most Religions not only do not do God's will but have no knowledge of what it should be.

Matthew 7:21-23
Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens,

but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will.


Many will say to me in that day: ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?’ And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness. . .


Really James

The Greek word translated as Good news is εὐαγγέλιον transliterated into English as euaggelion

Does εὐαγγέλιον appear anywhere in the extant Greek manuscript of the translated passage which you have quoted above.

Yes or no.

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:


In this case it is their lack of obedience to the Good news and the failure to do the will of the Almighty God for our day?

Most Religions not only do not do God's will but have no knowledge of what it should be.

Matthew 7:21-23
Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens,

but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will.


Many will say to me in that day: ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?’ And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness. . .


Really James

The Greek word translated as Good news is εὐαγγέλιον transliterated into English as euaggelion

Does εὐαγγέλιον appear anywhere in the extant Greek manuscript of the translated passage which you have quoted above.

Yes or no.

Regards

LeClerc


No it does not but those doing Gods will does.

What is God's will for our day?
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:


In this case it is their lack of obedience to the Good news and the failure to do the will of the Almighty God for our day?

Most Religions not only do not do God's will but have no knowledge of what it should be.

Matthew 7:21-23
Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens,

but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will.


Many will say to me in that day: ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?’ And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness. . .


Really James

The Greek word translated as Good news is εὐαγγέλιον transliterated into English as euaggelion

Does εὐαγγέλιον appear anywhere in the extant Greek manuscript of the translated passage which you have quoted above.

Yes or no.

Regards

LeClerc


No it does not but those doing Gods will does.

What is God's will for our day?


So you could answer yes or no to my question above but not to my yes or no question on another thread.

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:


In this case it is their lack of obedience to the Good news and the failure to do the will of the Almighty God for our day?

Most Religions not only do not do God's will but have no knowledge of what it should be.

Matthew 7:21-23
Not everyone saying to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter into the Kingdom of the heavens,

but only the one doing the will of my Father who is in the heavens will.


Many will say to me in that day: ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and expel demons in your name, and perform many powerful works in your name?’ And then I will declare to them: ‘I never knew you! Get away from me, you workers of lawlessness. . .


Really James

The Greek word translated as Good news is εὐαγγέλιον transliterated into English as euaggelion

Does εὐαγγέλιον appear anywhere in the extant Greek manuscript of the translated passage which you have quoted above.

Yes or no.

Regards

LeClerc


No it does not but those doing Gods will does.

What is God's will for our day?


So you could answer yes or no to my question above but not to my yes or no question on another thread.

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Regards

LeClerc


If you can find the scared secret of the judgement you will find the answer to your question,.
LeClerc

Hello James

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling


So you do not know the answer to my question, then Leclerc?

I thought clever people like to find their own answers so they can continue to be clever. Well here is a clue>>>\/

Matthew 5:3-12
Happy are those conscious of their spiritual need, since the Kingdom of the heavens belongs to them.

Happy are those who mourn, since they will be comforted.

Happy are the mild-tempered, since they will inherit the earth.

Happy are those hungering and thirsting for righteousness, since they will be filled.

Happy are the merciful, since they will be shown mercy.

Happy are the pure in heart, since they will see God.

Happy are the peacemakers, since they will be called sons of God. 1

Happy are those who have been persecuted for righteousness’ sake, since the Kingdom of the heavens belongs to them.

Happy are you when people reproach you and persecute you and lyingly say every sort of wicked thing against you for my sake.


Rejoice and be overjoyed, since your reward is great in the heavens, for in that way they persecuted the prophets prior to you.
LeClerc

Hello James

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Maybe you would like to check out the Greek word translated into the English as lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Maybe you would like to check out the Greek word translated into the English as lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc


Perhaps you would like to check out the law of the Christ and why we should wish to know it?
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Maybe you would like to check out the Greek word translated into the English as lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc


Perhaps you would like to check out the law of the Christ and why we should wish to know it?


Matthew 7
12  “All things, therefore, that you want men to do to you, you also must do to them. This, in fact, is what the Law and the Prophets mean

Galatians 5
14  For the entire Law has been fulfilled in one commandment, namely: “You must love your neighbor as yourself.”

At Mount Sinai the ten commandments of YHWH were written on tablets of stone by the finger of YHWH.

but at Mount Zion the Torah is written on tablets of the heart by the Spirit of YHWH.

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Maybe you would like to check out the Greek word translated into the English as lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc


Perhaps you would like to check out the law of the Christ and why we should wish to know it?


Matthew 7
12  “All things, therefore, that you want men to do to you, you also must do to them. This, in fact, is what the Law and the Prophets mean

Galatians 5
14  For the entire Law has been fulfilled in one commandment, namely: “You must love your neighbor as yourself.”

At Mount Sinai the ten commandments of YHWH were written on of tablets of stone by the finger of YHWH.

but at Mount Zion the Torah is written on tablets of the heart by the Spirit of YHWH.

Regards

LeClerc


Then how come you find telling me what the sacred secret of the judgement is?
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Maybe you would like to check out the Greek word translated into the English as lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc


Perhaps you would like to check out the law of the Christ and why we should wish to know it?


Matthew 7
12  “All things, therefore, that you want men to do to you, you also must do to them. This, in fact, is what the Law and the Prophets mean

Galatians 5
14  For the entire Law has been fulfilled in one commandment, namely: “You must love your neighbor as yourself.”

At Mount Sinai the ten commandments of YHWH were written on of tablets of stone by the finger of YHWH.

but at Mount Zion the Torah is written on tablets of the heart by the Spirit of YHWH.

Regards

LeClerc


Then how come you find telling me what the sacred secret of the judgement is?


Leviticus 19 NWT
18  “‘You must not take vengeance nor hold a grudge against the sons of your people, and you must love your fellow man as yourself. I am Jehovah.

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Maybe you would like to check out the Greek word translated into the English as lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc


Perhaps you would like to check out the law of the Christ and why we should wish to know it?


Matthew 7
12  “All things, therefore, that you want men to do to you, you also must do to them. This, in fact, is what the Law and the Prophets mean

Galatians 5
14  For the entire Law has been fulfilled in one commandment, namely: “You must love your neighbor as yourself.”

At Mount Sinai the ten commandments of YHWH were written on of tablets of stone by the finger of YHWH.

but at Mount Zion the Torah is written on tablets of the heart by the Spirit of YHWH.

Regards

LeClerc


Then how come you find telling me what the sacred secret of the judgement is?


Leviticus 19 NWT
18  “‘You must not take vengeance nor hold a grudge against the sons of your people, and you must love your fellow man as yourself. I am Jehovah.

Regards

LeClerc


No that is not it.

How many different judgements are there?
LeClerc

Hello James

More evasion tactics James.

I do believe you started this thread and gave it the heading ''what makes an apostate''

If you want to start a new thread on the sacred secret of the judgement go ahead.

Now back to what makes an apostate ?

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Maybe you would like to check out the Greek word translated into the English as lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

More evasion tactics James.

I do believe you started this thread and gave it the heading ''what makes an apostate''

If you want to start a new thread on the sacred secret of the judgement go ahead.

Now back to what makes an apostate ?

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Maybe you would like to check out the Greek word translated into the English as lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc


Would you say today an apostate is one that possesses the kingdom proclaimers, or those that are quite happy with the old traditional teachings of the church but who now oppose those that accept that Christians must wash their robes and make them white ready for Jesus to be able to say good and faithful slave?

What other stumbling blocks are there in the kingdom?

Those who do not have the teachings of Jesus perhaps as regards the last days may be?

Acts 15:16-20
After these things I will return and raise up again the tent of David that is fallen down; I will rebuild its ruins and restore it,  so that the men who remain may earnestly seek Jehovah, together with people of all the nations, people who are called by my name, says Jehovah, who is doing these things,  known from of old.’

Therefore, my decision is not to trouble those from the nations who are turning to God,

but to write them to abstain from things polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from what is strangled, and from blood.
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:


LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

More evasion tactics James.

I do believe you started this thread and gave it the heading ''what makes an apostate''

If you want to start a new thread on the sacred secret of the judgement go ahead.

Now back to what makes an apostate ?

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Maybe you would like to check out the Greek word translated into the English as lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc


Would you say today an apostate is one that possesses the kingdom proclaimers, or those that are quite happy with the old traditional teachings of the church but who now oppose those that accept that Christians must wash their robes and make them white ready for Jesus to be able to say good and faithful slave?

What other stumbling blocks are there in the kingdom?

Those who do not have the teachings of Jesus perhaps as regards the last days may be?

Acts 15:16-20
After these things I will return and raise up again the tent of David that is fallen down; I will rebuild its ruins and restore it,  so that the men who remain may earnestly seek Jehovah, together with people of all the nations, people who are called by my name, says Jehovah, who is doing these things,  known from of old.’

Therefore, my decision is not to trouble those from the nations who are turning to God,

but to write them to abstain from things polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from what is strangled, and from blood.


More evasion tactics James.

I do believe you started this thread and gave it the heading ''what makes an apostate''

If you want to start a new thread on the sacred secret of the judgement go ahead.

Now back to what makes an apostate ?

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Maybe you would like to check out the Greek word translated into the English as lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:


LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

More evasion tactics James.

I do believe you started this thread and gave it the heading ''what makes an apostate''

If you want to start a new thread on the sacred secret of the judgement go ahead.

Now back to what makes an apostate ?

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Maybe you would like to check out the Greek word translated into the English as lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc


Would you say today an apostate is one that possesses the kingdom proclaimers, or those that are quite happy with the old traditional teachings of the church but who now oppose those that accept that Christians must wash their robes and make them white ready for Jesus to be able to say good and faithful slave?

What other stumbling blocks are there in the kingdom?

Those who do not have the teachings of Jesus perhaps as regards the last days may be?

Acts 15:16-20
After these things I will return and raise up again the tent of David that is fallen down; I will rebuild its ruins and restore it,  so that the men who remain may earnestly seek Jehovah, together with people of all the nations, people who are called by my name, says Jehovah, who is doing these things,  known from of old.’

Therefore, my decision is not to trouble those from the nations who are turning to God,

but to write them to abstain from things polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from what is strangled, and from blood.


More evasion tactics James.

I do believe you started this thread and gave it the heading ''what makes an apostate''

If you want to start a new thread on the sacred secret of the judgement go ahead.

Now back to what makes an apostate ?

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Maybe you would like to check out the Greek word translated into the English as lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc


Where is the Kingdom that you are referring to?

Perhaps the answer will be more obvious when we have that answer?

John 1:16-18
For we all received from his fullness, even undeserved kindness upon undeserved kindness. Because the Law was given through Moses, the undeserved kindness and the truth came to be through Jesus Christ. No man has seen God at any time; the only-begotten god who is at the Father’s side is the one who has explained Him.

Acts 14:3, 4
So they spent considerable time speaking with boldness by the authority of Jehovah, who bore witness to the word of his undeserved kindness by allowing signs and wonders to be performed through them. However, the multitude of the city was divided; some were for the Jews but others for the apostles.

Acts 20:31, 32
Therefore keep awake, and bear in mind that for three years, night and day, I never stopped admonishing each one of you with tears. And now I entrust you to God and to the word of his undeserved kindness, which word can build you up and give you the inheritance among all the sanctified ones. . .

Romans 3:26
.This was to demonstrate his own righteousness in this present season, so that he might be righteous even when declaring righteous the man who has faith in Jesus.

Romans 5:17
.For if by the trespass of the one man death ruled as king through that one, how much more will those who receive the abundance of the undeserved kindness and of the free gift of righteousness rule as kings in life through the one person, Jesus Christ!


John 17:3
.This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:


LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

More evasion tactics James.

I do believe you started this thread and gave it the heading ''what makes an apostate''

If you want to start a new thread on the sacred secret of the judgement go ahead.

Now back to what makes an apostate ?

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Maybe you would like to check out the Greek word translated into the English as lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc


Would you say today an apostate is one that possesses the kingdom proclaimers, or those that are quite happy with the old traditional teachings of the church but who now oppose those that accept that Christians must wash their robes and make them white ready for Jesus to be able to say good and faithful slave?

What other stumbling blocks are there in the kingdom?

Those who do not have the teachings of Jesus perhaps as regards the last days may be?

Acts 15:16-20
After these things I will return and raise up again the tent of David that is fallen down; I will rebuild its ruins and restore it,  so that the men who remain may earnestly seek Jehovah, together with people of all the nations, people who are called by my name, says Jehovah, who is doing these things,  known from of old.’

Therefore, my decision is not to trouble those from the nations who are turning to God,

but to write them to abstain from things polluted by idols, from sexual immorality, from what is strangled, and from blood.


More evasion tactics James.

I do believe you started this thread and gave it the heading ''what makes an apostate''

If you want to start a new thread on the sacred secret of the judgement go ahead.

Now back to what makes an apostate ?

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

What is the definition of lawlessness in the above scripture ?

Maybe you would like to check out the Greek word translated into the English as lawlessness.

Regards

LeClerc


Where is the Kingdom that you are referring to?

Perhaps the answer will be more obvious when we have that answer?

John 1:16-18
For we all received from his fullness, even undeserved kindness upon undeserved kindness. Because the Law was given through Moses, the undeserved kindness and the truth came to be through Jesus Christ. No man has seen God at any time; the only-begotten god who is at the Father’s side is the one who has explained Him.

Acts 14:3, 4
So they spent considerable time speaking with boldness by the authority of Jehovah, who bore witness to the word of his undeserved kindness by allowing signs and wonders to be performed through them. However, the multitude of the city was divided; some were for the Jews but others for the apostles.

Acts 20:31, 32
Therefore keep awake, and bear in mind that for three years, night and day, I never stopped admonishing each one of you with tears. And now I entrust you to God and to the word of his undeserved kindness, which word can build you up and give you the inheritance among all the sanctified ones. . .

Romans 3:26
.This was to demonstrate his own righteousness in this present season, so that he might be righteous even when declaring righteous the man who has faith in Jesus.

Romans 5:17
.For if by the trespass of the one man death ruled as king through that one, how much more will those who receive the abundance of the undeserved kindness and of the free gift of righteousness rule as kings in life through the one person, Jesus Christ!


John 17:3
.This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.


Those that will be collected out from his kingdom and pitch them into the fiery furnace are the people who practice what ?

Matthew 13
41  The Son of man will send his angels, and they will collect out from his Kingdom all things that cause stumbling and people who practice lawlessness,42  and they will pitch them into the fiery furnace. There is where their weeping and the gnashing of their teeth will be.

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

Which law?


John 13:34, 35
 I am giving you a new commandment, that you love one another; just as I have loved you, you also love one another.

 By this all will know that you are my disciples—if you have love among yourselves.
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
Which law?


John 13:34, 35
 I am giving you a new commandment, that you love one another; just as I have loved you, you also love one another.

 By this all will know that you are my disciples—if you have love among yourselves.


You are confusing Mitzvah with Torah. The Torah contains Mitzvah.

What Y'shua was giving was a mitzvah chadasha.

John 13 Orthodox Jewish Bible
34 A mitzvah chadasha I give to you, that you have ahavah (agape) one for the other, as I have had ahavah (agape) for you, so also you have ahavah (agape) one for the another. [VAYIKRA 19:18]

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
Which law?


John 13:34, 35
 I am giving you a new commandment, that you love one another; just as I have loved you, you also love one another.

 By this all will know that you are my disciples—if you have love among yourselves.


You are confusing Mitzvah with Torah. The Torah contains Mitzvah.

What Y'shua was giving was a mitzvah chadasha.

John 13 Orthodox Jewish Bible
34 A mitzvah chadasha I give to you, that you have ahavah (agape) one for the other, as I have had ahavah (agape) for you, so also you have ahavah (agape) one for the another. [VAYIKRA 19:18]

Regards

LeClerc


So can Christians keep the law and be saved?
LeClerc

Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
Which law?


John 13:34, 35
 I am giving you a new commandment, that you love one another; just as I have loved you, you also love one another.

 By this all will know that you are my disciples—if you have love among yourselves.


You are confusing Mitzvah with Torah. The Torah contains Mitzvah.

What Y'shua was giving was a mitzvah chadasha.

John 13 Orthodox Jewish Bible
34 A mitzvah chadasha I give to you, that you have ahavah (agape) one for the other, as I have had ahavah (agape) for you, so also you have ahavah (agape) one for the another. [VAYIKRA 19:18]

Regards

LeClerc


So can Christians keep the law and be saved?


Christians cannot keep Torah in the flesh through legalistic observance any more than disobedient Israel could keep the Torah in the flesh through legalistic observance.

So, how are Christians credited with righeousness, lets begin here

Romans 3
19 Moreover, we know that whatever the Torah says, it says to those living within the framework of the Torah, in order that every mouth may be stopped and the whole world be shown to deserve God’s adverse judgment. 20 For in his sight no one alive will be considered righteous on the ground of legalistic observance of Torah commands, because what Torah really does is show people how sinful they are.

21 But now, quite apart from Torah, God’s way of making people righteous in his sight has been made clear — although the Torah and the Prophets give their witness to it as well — 22 and it is a righteousness that comes from God, through the faithfulness of Yeshua the Messiah, to all who continue trusting. For it makes no difference whether one is a Jew or a Gentile, 23 since all have sinned and come short of earning God’s praise. 24 By God’s grace, without earning it, all are granted the status of being considered righteous before him, through the act redeeming us from our enslavement to sin that was accomplished by the Messiah Yeshua. 25 God put Yeshua forward as the kapparah for sin through his faithfulness in respect to his bloody sacrificial death. This vindicated God’s righteousness; because, in his forbearance, he had passed over [with neither punishment nor remission] the sins people had committed in the past; 26 and it vindicates his righteousness in the present age by showing that he is righteous himself and is also the one who makes people righteous on the ground of Yeshua’s faithfulness.

27 So what room is left for boasting? None at all! What kind of Torah excludes it? One that has to do with legalistic observance of rules? No, rather, a Torah that has to do with trusting. 28 Therefore, we hold the view that a person comes to be considered righteous by God on the ground of trusting, which has nothing to do with legalistic observance of Torah commands.

29 Or is God the God of the Jews only? Isn’t he also the God of the Gentiles? Yes, he is indeed the God of the Gentiles; 30 because, as you will admit, God is one. Therefore, he will consider righteous the circumcised on the ground of trusting and the uncircumcised through that same trusting. 31 Does it follow that we abolish Torah by this trusting? Heaven forbid! On the contrary, we confirm Torah.


Is Torah abolished by trusting ?

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
Which law?


John 13:34, 35
 I am giving you a new commandment, that you love one another; just as I have loved you, you also love one another.

 By this all will know that you are my disciples—if you have love among yourselves.


You are confusing Mitzvah with Torah. The Torah contains Mitzvah.

What Y'shua was giving was a mitzvah chadasha.

John 13 Orthodox Jewish Bible
34 A mitzvah chadasha I give to you, that you have ahavah (agape) one for the other, as I have had ahavah (agape) for you, so also you have ahavah (agape) one for the another. [VAYIKRA 19:18]

Regards

LeClerc


So can Christians keep the law and be saved?


Christians cannot keep Torah in the flesh through legalistic observance any more than disobedient Israel could keep the Torah in the flesh through legalistic observance.

So, how are Christians credited with righeousness, lets begin here

Romans 3
19 Moreover, we know that whatever the Torah says, it says to those living within the framework of the Torah, in order that every mouth may be stopped and the whole world be shown to deserve God’s adverse judgment. 20 For in his sight no one alive will be considered righteous on the ground of legalistic observance of Torah commands, because what Torah really does is show people how sinful they are.

21 But now, quite apart from Torah, God’s way of making people righteous in his sight has been made clear — although the Torah and the Prophets give their witness to it as well — 22 and it is a righteousness that comes from God, through the faithfulness of Yeshua the Messiah, to all who continue trusting. For it makes no difference whether one is a Jew or a Gentile, 23 since all have sinned and come short of earning God’s praise. 24 By God’s grace, without earning it, all are granted the status of being considered righteous before him, through the act redeeming us from our enslavement to sin that was accomplished by the Messiah Yeshua. 25 God put Yeshua forward as the kapparah for sin through his faithfulness in respect to his bloody sacrificial death. This vindicated God’s righteousness; because, in his forbearance, he had passed over [with neither punishment nor remission] the sins people had committed in the past; 26 and it vindicates his righteousness in the present age by showing that he is righteous himself and is also the one who makes people righteous on the ground of Yeshua’s faithfulness.

27 So what room is left for boasting? None at all! What kind of Torah excludes it? One that has to do with legalistic observance of rules? No, rather, a Torah that has to do with trusting. 28 Therefore, we hold the view that a person comes to be considered righteous by God on the ground of trusting, which has nothing to do with legalistic observance of Torah commands.

29 Or is God the God of the Jews only? Isn’t he also the God of the Gentiles? Yes, he is indeed the God of the Gentiles; 30 because, as you will admit, God is one. Therefore, he will consider righteous the circumcised on the ground of trusting and the uncircumcised through that same trusting. 31 Does it follow that we abolish Torah by this trusting? Heaven forbid! On the contrary, we confirm Torah.


Is Torah abolished by trusting ?

Regards

LeClerc


What a relief, most bibles just use faith instead of trusting so not much of a problem there now is there?

So now can we identify who are apostates today?
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
Which law?


John 13:34, 35
 I am giving you a new commandment, that you love one another; just as I have loved you, you also love one another.

 By this all will know that you are my disciples—if you have love among yourselves.


You are confusing Mitzvah with Torah. The Torah contains Mitzvah.

What Y'shua was giving was a mitzvah chadasha.

John 13 Orthodox Jewish Bible
34 A mitzvah chadasha I give to you, that you have ahavah (agape) one for the other, as I have had ahavah (agape) for you, so also you have ahavah (agape) one for the another. [VAYIKRA 19:18]

Regards

LeClerc


So can Christians keep the law and be saved?


Christians cannot keep Torah in the flesh through legalistic observance any more than disobedient Israel could keep the Torah in the flesh through legalistic observance.

So, how are Christians credited with righeousness, lets begin here

Romans 3
19 Moreover, we know that whatever the Torah says, it says to those living within the framework of the Torah, in order that every mouth may be stopped and the whole world be shown to deserve God’s adverse judgment. 20 For in his sight no one alive will be considered righteous on the ground of legalistic observance of Torah commands, because what Torah really does is show people how sinful they are.

21 But now, quite apart from Torah, God’s way of making people righteous in his sight has been made clear — although the Torah and the Prophets give their witness to it as well — 22 and it is a righteousness that comes from God, through the faithfulness of Yeshua the Messiah, to all who continue trusting. For it makes no difference whether one is a Jew or a Gentile, 23 since all have sinned and come short of earning God’s praise. 24 By God’s grace, without earning it, all are granted the status of being considered righteous before him, through the act redeeming us from our enslavement to sin that was accomplished by the Messiah Yeshua. 25 God put Yeshua forward as the kapparah for sin through his faithfulness in respect to his bloody sacrificial death. This vindicated God’s righteousness; because, in his forbearance, he had passed over [with neither punishment nor remission] the sins people had committed in the past; 26 and it vindicates his righteousness in the present age by showing that he is righteous himself and is also the one who makes people righteous on the ground of Yeshua’s faithfulness.

27 So what room is left for boasting? None at all! What kind of Torah excludes it? One that has to do with legalistic observance of rules? No, rather, a Torah that has to do with trusting. 28 Therefore, we hold the view that a person comes to be considered righteous by God on the ground of trusting, which has nothing to do with legalistic observance of Torah commands.

29 Or is God the God of the Jews only? Isn’t he also the God of the Gentiles? Yes, he is indeed the God of the Gentiles; 30 because, as you will admit, God is one. Therefore, he will consider righteous the circumcised on the ground of trusting and the uncircumcised through that same trusting. 31 Does it follow that we abolish Torah by this trusting? Heaven forbid! On the contrary, we confirm Torah.


Is Torah abolished by trusting ?

Regards

LeClerc


What a relief, most bibles just use faith instead of trusting so not much of a problem there now is there?



Well there is for you from what you have just posted, since you use the New World Translation I believe.

Romans 3 NWT
19  Now we know that all the things the Law says, it addresses to those under the Law, so that every mouth may be silenced and all the world may become accountable to God for punishment.20  Therefore, no one will be declared righteous before him by works of law, for by law comes the accurate knowledge of sin. 21  But now apart from law God’s righteousness has been revealed, as the Law and the Prophets bear witness,22  yes, God’s righteousness through the faith in Jesus Christ, for all those having faith. For there is no distinction.23  For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,24  and it is as a free gift that they are being declared righteous by his undeserved kindness through the release by the ransom paid by Christ Jesus.25  God presented him as an offering for propitiation through faith in his blood. This was to demonstrate his own righteousness, because God in his forbearance was forgiving the sins that occurred in the past.26  This was to demonstrate his own righteousness in this present season, so that he might be righteous even when declaring righteous the man who has faith in Jesus. 27  Where, then, is the boasting? There is no place for it. Through what law? That of works? No indeed, but through the law of faith.28  For we consider that a man is declared righteous by faith apart from works of law.29  Or is he the God of the Jews only? Is he not also the God of people of the nations? Yes, also of people of the nations.30  Since God is one, he will declare circumcised people righteous as a result of faith and uncircumcised people righteous by means of their faith.31  Do we, then, abolish law by means of our faith? Not at all! On the contrary, we uphold law.

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
Which law?


John 13:34, 35
 I am giving you a new commandment, that you love one another; just as I have loved you, you also love one another.

 By this all will know that you are my disciples—if you have love among yourselves.


You are confusing Mitzvah with Torah. The Torah contains Mitzvah.

What Y'shua was giving was a mitzvah chadasha.

John 13 Orthodox Jewish Bible
34 A mitzvah chadasha I give to you, that you have ahavah (agape) one for the other, as I have had ahavah (agape) for you, so also you have ahavah (agape) one for the another. [VAYIKRA 19:18]

Regards

LeClerc


So can Christians keep the law and be saved?


Christians cannot keep Torah in the flesh through legalistic observance any more than disobedient Israel could keep the Torah in the flesh through legalistic observance.

So, how are Christians credited with righeousness, lets begin here

Romans 3
19 Moreover, we know that whatever the Torah says, it says to those living within the framework of the Torah, in order that every mouth may be stopped and the whole world be shown to deserve God’s adverse judgment. 20 For in his sight no one alive will be considered righteous on the ground of legalistic observance of Torah commands, because what Torah really does is show people how sinful they are.

21 But now, quite apart from Torah, God’s way of making people righteous in his sight has been made clear — although the Torah and the Prophets give their witness to it as well — 22 and it is a righteousness that comes from God, through the faithfulness of Yeshua the Messiah, to all who continue trusting. For it makes no difference whether one is a Jew or a Gentile, 23 since all have sinned and come short of earning God’s praise. 24 By God’s grace, without earning it, all are granted the status of being considered righteous before him, through the act redeeming us from our enslavement to sin that was accomplished by the Messiah Yeshua. 25 God put Yeshua forward as the kapparah for sin through his faithfulness in respect to his bloody sacrificial death. This vindicated God’s righteousness; because, in his forbearance, he had passed over [with neither punishment nor remission] the sins people had committed in the past; 26 and it vindicates his righteousness in the present age by showing that he is righteous himself and is also the one who makes people righteous on the ground of Yeshua’s faithfulness.

27 So what room is left for boasting? None at all! What kind of Torah excludes it? One that has to do with legalistic observance of rules? No, rather, a Torah that has to do with trusting. 28 Therefore, we hold the view that a person comes to be considered righteous by God on the ground of trusting, which has nothing to do with legalistic observance of Torah commands.

29 Or is God the God of the Jews only? Isn’t he also the God of the Gentiles? Yes, he is indeed the God of the Gentiles; 30 because, as you will admit, God is one. Therefore, he will consider righteous the circumcised on the ground of trusting and the uncircumcised through that same trusting. 31 Does it follow that we abolish Torah by this trusting? Heaven forbid! On the contrary, we confirm Torah.


Is Torah abolished by trusting ?

Regards

LeClerc


What a relief, most bibles just use faith instead of trusting so not much of a problem there now is there?



Well there is for you from what you have just posted, since you use the New World Translation I believe.

Romans 3 NWT
19  Now we know that all the things the Law says, it addresses to those under the Law, so that every mouth may be silenced and all the world may become accountable to God for punishment.20  Therefore, no one will be declared righteous before him by works of law, for by law comes the accurate knowledge of sin. 21  But now apart from law God’s righteousness has been revealed, as the Law and the Prophets bear witness,22  yes, God’s righteousness through the faith in Jesus Christ, for all those having faith. For there is no distinction.23  For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,24  and it is as a free gift that they are being declared righteous by his undeserved kindness through the release by the ransom paid by Christ Jesus.25  God presented him as an offering for propitiation through faith in his blood. This was to demonstrate his own righteousness, because God in his forbearance was forgiving the sins that occurred in the past.26  This was to demonstrate his own righteousness in this present season, so that he might be righteous even when declaring righteous the man who has faith in Jesus. 27  Where, then, is the boasting? There is no place for it. Through what law? That of works? No indeed, but through the law of faith.28  For we consider that a man is declared righteous by faith apart from works of law.29  Or is he the God of the Jews only? Is he not also the God of people of the nations? Yes, also of people of the nations.30  Since God is one, he will declare circumcised people righteous as a result of faith and uncircumcised people righteous by means of their faith.31  Do we, then, abolish law by means of our faith? Not at all! On the contrary, we uphold law.

Regards

LeClerc


I use most translations if required to do so the NWT is convenient to me  because it aim is accuracy.
LeClerc

Morning James

JamesJah wrote:


I use most translations if required to do so the NWT is convenient to me  because it aim is accuracy.


Do you consider the following translation to be accurate ?

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:


I use most translations if required to do so the NWT is convenient to me  because it aim is accuracy.


Do you consider the following translation to be accurate ?

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

Regards

LeClerc


I think it ia as accurate as the scripture which sais Solomon built the temple.
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:


I use most translations if required to do so the NWT is convenient to me  because it aim is accuracy.


Do you consider the following translation to be accurate ?

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

Regards

LeClerc


I think it ia as accurate as the scripture which sais Solomon built the temple.


Right James, according to the following scripture

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

What  is the personal name of the mighty One ?

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:


I use most translations if required to do so the NWT is convenient to me  because it aim is accuracy.


Do you consider the following translation to be accurate ?

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

Regards

LeClerc


I think it ia as accurate as the scripture which sais Solomon built the temple.


Right James, according to the following scripture

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

What  is the personal name of the mighty One ?

Regards

LeClerc


The one who can become what he chooses to become when did Jehovah become King?
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:


I use most translations if required to do so the NWT is convenient to me  because it aim is accuracy.


Do you consider the following translation to be accurate ?

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

Regards

LeClerc


I think it ia as accurate as the scripture which sais Solomon built the temple.


Right James, according to the following scripture

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

What  is the personal name of the mighty One ?

Regards

LeClerc


The one who can become what he chooses to become when did Jehovah become King?


What is the name of the one ?

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:


I use most translations if required to do so the NWT is convenient to me  because it aim is accuracy.


Do you consider the following translation to be accurate ?

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

Regards

LeClerc


I think it ia as accurate as the scripture which sais Solomon built the temple.


Right James, according to the following scripture

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

What  is the personal name of the mighty One ?

Regards

LeClerc


The one who can become what he chooses to become when did Jehovah become King?


What is the name of the one ?

Regards

LeClerc


What religion are you Leclerc?

Is Jesus  equal to Jehovah in you religion?

When does the first resurrection happen?

Some coming here seem to think they can use the saints to curry favour with the Almighty.

*Is scripture not plain enough for them?

O yes and how many can be Almighty?
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:


I use most translations if required to do so the NWT is convenient to me  because it aim is accuracy.


Do you consider the following translation to be accurate ?

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

Regards

LeClerc


I think it ia as accurate as the scripture which sais Solomon built the temple.


Right James, according to the following scripture

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

What  is the personal name of the mighty One ?

Regards

LeClerc


The one who can become what he chooses to become when did Jehovah become King?


What is the name of the one ?

Still waiting  

Regards

LeClerc
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:


I use most translations if required to do so the NWT is convenient to me  because it aim is accuracy.


Do you consider the following translation to be accurate ?

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

Regards

LeClerc


I think it ia as accurate as the scripture which sais Solomon built the temple.


Right James, according to the following scripture

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

What  is the personal name of the mighty One ?

Regards

LeClerc


The one who can become what he chooses to become when did Jehovah become King?


What is the name of the one ?

Still waiting  

Regards

LeClerc


Michael
LeClerc

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Morning James

JamesJah wrote:


I use most translations if required to do so the NWT is convenient to me  because it aim is accuracy.


Do you consider the following translation to be accurate ?

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

Regards

LeClerc


I think it ia as accurate as the scripture which sais Solomon built the temple.


Right James, according to the following scripture

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

What  is the personal name of the mighty One ?

Regards

LeClerc


The one who can become what he chooses to become when did Jehovah become King?


What is the name of the one ?

Still waiting  

Regards

LeClerc


Michael


Lets be clear here James

You are saying the name of the mighty One in the following scripture

Jeremiah 32 NWT
7  “Alas, O Sovereign Lord Jehovah! Look! You made the heavens and the earth by your great power and by your outstretched arm. Nothing is too wonderful for you,18  the One showing loyal love to thousands, but repaying the error of the fathers to their sons after them, the true God, the great and mighty One, whose name is Jehovah of armies.

is Michael ?

Regards

LeClerc

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