Archive for nglreturns.myfreeforum.org Nglreturns is a forum to discuss religion, philosophy, ethics etc...

NGLReturns Daily Quiz - Play here!
 



       nglreturns.myfreeforum.org Forum Index -> Christian chat
JamesJah

Which is the most important Sabbath?

Which Sabbath was this one?

Isaiah 58:13, 14
If in view of the Sabbath you will turn back your foot as regards doing your own delights on my holy day, and will actually call the Sabbath an exquisite delight, a holy [day] of Jehovah, one being glorified, and will actually glorify it rather than doing your own ways, rather than finding what delights you and speaking a word; you will in that case find your exquisite delight in Jehovah, and I will make you ride upon the high places of the earth; and I will cause you to eat from the hereditary possession of Jacob your forefather, for the mouth of Jehovah itself has spoken [it].
Farmer Geddon

Not sure what you are trying to argue here JJ?

"for the mouth of Jehovah itself has spoken [it]."

[Although I commend how the quote claims that 'Jehovah' is an it]!

But its mouth says:

Exodus 31:13-17 “Tell the people of Isra’el, ‘You are to observe my Shabbats; for this is a sign between me and you through all your generations; so that you will know that I am Adonai, who sets you apart for me. 14 Therefore you are to keep my Shabbat, because it is set apart for you. Everyone who treats it as ordinary must be put to death; for whoever does any work on it is to be cut off from his people. 15 On six days work will get done; but the seventh day is Shabbat, for complete rest, set apart for Adonai. Whoever does any work on the day of Shabbat must be put to death. 16 The people of Isra’el are to keep the Shabbat, to observe Shabbat through all their generations as a perpetual covenant. 17 It is a sign between me and the people of Isra’el forever; for in six days Adonai made heaven and earth, but on the seventh day he stopped working and rested.’”

Deuteronomy 5:15 "You are to remember that you were a slave in the land of Egypt, and Adonai your God brought you out from there with a strong hand and an outstretched arm. Therefore Adonai your God has ordered you to keep the day of Shabbat."

Exodus 20:11 "For in six days, Adonai made heaven and earth, the sea and everything in them; but on the seventh day he rested. This is why Adonai blessed the day, Shabbat, and separated it for himself."

I'm guessing it's to tell its people to "Remember the Sabbath day to sanctify it." (Hebrew: Zakhor et yom ha-Shabbat l'kad'sho) - Exodus 20:8;

"Observe the Sabbath day to sanctify it." (Hebrew: Shamor et yom ha-Shabbat l'kad'sho) -Deuteronomy 5:12.

Which starts on Friday at Sunset and ends at nightfall on Saturday, when three stars are visible... is that the answer you were hoping for?
JamesJah

As far as I know only a JW will comprehend what I am getting at Farmer.

The Hebrews had many Sabbaths, some of which they still keep, but there was one they failed to keep, why was that?
LeClerc

Hi James

Hebrews 4
9 So there remains a Shabbat-keeping for God’s people. 10 For the one who has entered God’s rest has also rested from his own works, as God did from his. 11 Therefore, let us do our best to enter that rest; so that no one will fall short because of the same kind of disobedience.

LeClerc
JamesJah

Well done LerClerc that is the one.

Now the question is have you entered in to it, do you know what it is?
LeClerc

Hi James

JamesJah wrote:
Well done LerClerc that is the one.

Now the question is have you entered in to it, do you know what it is?


Wrong questions for the moment James.

The question should be, how does one enter into it ?

Then we can answer the two questions you have asked.

LeClerc
JamesJah

Which Sabbath is it?
LeClerc

Hi James

JamesJah wrote:
Which Sabbath is it?


Hebrews 4
9 So there remains a Shabbat-keeping for God’s people. 10 For the one who has entered God’s rest has also rested from his own works, as God did from his. 11 Therefore, let us do our best to enter that rest; so that no one will fall short because of the same kind of disobedience.

Now James how does one enter it ?

LeClerc
JamesJah

The instructions are clear LerClerc.

Now which Sabbath is it?
LeClerc

Hi James

JamesJah wrote:
The instructions are clear LerClerc.


It should not be a problem for you to post them then.

JamesJah wrote:
Now which Sabbath is it?


I have already given you the one and you have agreed,

JamesJah wrote:
Well done LerClerc that is the one.

Now the question is have you entered in to it, do you know what it is?


Now James how does one enter into it ?

LeClerc
JamesJah

Do you not read your own posts LerClerc??????????????

Therefore, let us do our best to enter that rest; so that no one will fall short because of the same kind of disobedience.

For the one who has entered God’s rest has also rested from his own works, as God did from his.

What are your works LerClerc?
Honey 56

Hi LeClerc,

Is there a clue in this scripture?

8For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9not by works, so that no one can boast.

Honey
JamesJah

Honey what will God reward people with who oppose his servants?

What are the workers in the vineyard rewarded with?

What happened to the one who buried his talent?
LeClerc

Hi Honey

Honey 56 wrote:
Hi LeClerc,

Is there a clue in this scripture?

8For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God— 9not by works, so that no one can boast.

Honey


Indeed there is sis

JamesJah wrote:
The instructions are clear LerClerc.


It should not be a problem for you to post them then.

JamesJah wrote:
Now which Sabbath is it?


I have already given you the one and you have agreed,

JamesJah wrote:
Well done LerClerc that is the one.

Now the question is have you entered in to it, do you know what it is?


Now James how does one enter into it ?

LeClerc
JamesJah

Become an imitator of Christ a doer of the word and not a hearer only.

Hebrews 5:9
after he had been made perfect he became responsible for everlasting salvation to all those obeying him,
LeClerc

Hi James

JamesJah wrote:
Become an imitator of Christ a doer of the word and not a hearer only.

Hebrews 5:9
after he had been made perfect he became responsible for everlasting salvation to all those obeying him,


Now we are getting closer James.

What is the first step of obedience for those who believe that Y'shua is Israel's Messiah, the Son of YHWH, the one Moses wrote about in the Torah, and about whom the prophets also wrote

LeClerc
JamesJah

Be a foot step follower of the leader LerClerc.

John 15:20, 21
Bear in mind the word I said to you, A slave is not greater than his master. If they have persecuted me, they will persecute you also; if they have observed my word, they will observe yours also. But they will do all these things against you on account of my name, because they do not know him that sent me.
Honey 56

JamesJah wrote:
Be a foot step follower of the leader LerClerc.


James,
Read the whole of the chapter and also the previous chapter.(Hebrews 3)

The answers are all there. If you don't make the mistake of quoting a scripture out of context and you consider the surrounding scripture also.

Honey
LeClerc

Hi James

JamesJah wrote:
Be a foot step follower of the leader LerClerc.

John 15:20, 21
Bear in mind the word I said to you, A slave is not greater than his master. If they have persecuted me, they will persecute you also; if they have observed my word, they will observe yours also. But they will do all these things against you on account of my name, because they do not know him that sent me.


According to your teaching Y'shua is a God other than YHWH God, why are you following after a God other than YHWH God when YHWH commands use not to do this.

LeClerc
JamesJah

I believe in rank an order to the universe, regardless of the deceptions perpetrated by the one who opposes.

The ruler of the universes rank is so high that it is above the heavens, the words which describe this in English and are understood by most humans is Almighty God.

Psalm 57:5
O be exalted above the heavens, O God; Let your glory be above all the earth.


Jesus is second to him and has been elevated above all other creatures because of outstanding obedience. He is a mighty god above all those that claim such for themselves. He has revealed the almighty to us by his word and actions.

Philippians 2:9-11
For this very reason also God exalted him to a superior position and kindly gave him the name that is above every [other] name, so that in the name of Jesus every knee should bend of those in heaven and those on earth and those under the ground, and every tongue should openly acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father.

The most exalted angels and attendees to the glory of the Almighty are next.

Hebrews 1:7-9
With reference to the angels he says: And he makes his angels spirits, and his public servants a flame of fire. But with reference to the Son: God is your throne forever and ever, and [the] sceptre of your kingdom is the sceptre of uprightness. You loved righteousness, and you hated lawlessness. That is why God, your God, anointed you with [the] oil of exultation more than your partners.”
Honey 56

JamesJah wrote:


Hebrews 1:7-9
With reference to the angels he says: And he makes his angels spirits, and his public servants a flame of fire. But with reference to the Son: God is your throne forever and ever, and [the] sceptre of your kingdom is the sceptre of uprightness. You loved righteousness, and you hated lawlessness. That is why God, your God, anointed you with [the] oil of exultation more than your partners.”


About this scripture James

Hebrews 1


The Son Superior to Angels


1In the past God spoke to our forefathers through the prophets at many times and in various ways, 2but in these last days he has spoken to us by his Son, whom he appointed heir of all things, and through whom he made the universe. 3The Son is the radiance of God’s glory and the exact representation of his being, sustaining all things by his powerful word. After he had provided purification for sins, he sat down at the right hand of the Majesty in heaven. 4So he became as much superior to the angels as the name he has inherited is superior to theirs.

5For to which of the angels did God ever say,

“You are my Son;

today I have become your Fathera
”b?

Or again,

I will be his Father,

and he will be my Son”c?


6And again, when God brings his firstborn into the world, he says,

“Let all God’s angels worship him.”
d

7In speaking of the angels he says,

“He makes his angels winds,

his servants flames of fire.”e

8But about the Son he says,

“Your throne, O God, will last for ever and ever,


and righteousness will be the scepter of your kingdom.

9You have loved righteousness and hated wickedness;

therefore God, your God, has set you above your companions

by anointing you with the oil of joy.”f

10He also says,

“In the beginning, O Lord, you laid the foundations of the earth,

and the heavens are the work of your hands.

11They will perish, but you remain;

they will all wear out like a garment.

12You will roll them up like a robe;

like a garment they will be changed.

But you remain the same,

and your years will never end.”g

13To which of the angels did God ever say,

“Sit at my right hand

until I make your enemies

a footstool for your feet”h?


14Are not all angels ministering spirits sent to serve those who will inherit salvation?


And yet the WTBTS teach you that Jesus the Messiah is the Archangel Michael.

In light of this scripture, how can you believe this teaching James?

Honey
JamesJah

When was Jesus a little lower than the angels Honey?

How many names does Jesus have now?

What was his name in the heavens before he had the name Jesus, or {Jah with us}?
Honey 56

JamesJah wrote:
When was Jesus a little lower than the angels Honey?
How many names does Jesus have now?
What was his name in the heavens before he had the name Jesus, or {Jah with us}?


The Word/Logos has always been YHWH, eternally.

Jesus has always had many names and titles, as does the Father.

When YHWH took on flesh and became a human being. He was a little lower than the angels because of His humanity.

But we see Jesus, who was *made a little lower than the angels, now crowned with glory and honor because he suffered death, so that by the grace of God he might taste death for everyone
Hebrew 2


*The word 'made' here does not mean created……
elattoó: to make less (in rank or influence)
Original Word: ἐλαττόω
Part of Speech: Verb
Transliteration: elattoó
Phonetic Spelling: (el-at-to'-o)
Short Definition: I make less, make inferior
Definition: I make less (inferior).

Because God's children are human beings--made of flesh and blood--the Son also became flesh and blood. For only as a human being could he die, and only by dying could he break the power of the devil, who had the power of death.
Hebrews 2


Honey
bnabernard

Quarts into pint pots again.

Flesh is creation just like a fridge.

bernard (hug)
JamesJah

Does that mean honey, we now accept Jesus was at one time a little lower than the angels?
Honey 56

JamesJah wrote:
Does that mean honey, we now accept Jesus was at one time a little lower than the angels?


Never in dispute James.
Does that mean that we accept Jesus was not created that way, or any other way?

Honey
JamesJah

Is that the scriptures according tooooo Hon??????????????????

Matthew 12:36, 37
I tell you that every unprofitable saying that men speak, they will render an account concerning it on Judgment Day; for by your words you will be declared righteous, and by your words you will be condemned
Honey 56

Quote:
[quote="JamesJah:81059"]Is that the scriptures according tooooo Hon??????????????????


No James, the Gospel according to YHWH
Unless of course you can find a scripture that says that Jesus was created?
Created not begotten? (different terminology and different words)

I have asked on several occasions and still, none forthcoming.
Could that be because there isn't one?


Honey
Honey 56

bnabernard wrote:
Quarts into pint pots again.

Flesh is creation just like a fridge.

bernard (hug)


Are you now saying that Jesus is a created being Bernard?

Just the other day you were saying that Jesus is God in the flesh.

I don't believe He can be both of these things, do you ?

honey
bnabernard

Hi Honey

Consider the Lilly, God creates the earth God creates the seed, God creates the water, and God creates the sun, God is the law by which the seed Grows. The Lilly is created.

bernard (hug)
Honey 56

bnabernard wrote:
Hi Honey

Consider the Lilly, God creates the earth God creates the seed, God creates the water, and God creates the sun, God is the law by which the seed Grows. The Lilly is created.

bernard (hug)


Hi Bernard,
You are correct when you say that God created everything, God the El-o-him.....

1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning.

3Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4In him was life, and that life was the light of men. 5The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it.

John 1.

Messiah Yeshua is this Word, the Logos.

This gospel writer was right when He said that the darkness has not understood it, but Jesus is the truth, the light, and the life and no one comes to the Father except through HIm.

The light shines on.

Honey
bnabernard

Is Yeshua/Jesus the Messiah.

bernard (hug)
LeClerc

Hi James

JamesJah wrote:
When was Jesus a little lower than the angels Honey?

How many names does Jesus have now?

What was his name in the heavens before he had the name Jesus, or {Jah with us}?


Hebrews 1 NWT
4So he has become better than the angels, to the extent that he has inherited a name more excellent than theirs.

The Son could only inherit from His Father what His Father Himself possessed.

What name did the Father possess which the Son inherited ?

LeClerc
JamesJah

What do Trinitarians make of these  scriptures????

Psalm 83:18
That people may know that you, whose name is Jehovah, You alone are the Most High over all the earth.

Psalm 82:1
God is stationing himself in the assembly of the Divine One; In the middle of the gods he judges:

Psalm 82:6
I myself have said, you are gods, And all of you are sons of the Most High.
LeClerc

Hi James

JamesJah wrote:
When was Jesus a little lower than the angels Honey?

How many names does Jesus have now?

What was his name in the heavens before he had the name Jesus, or {Jah with us}?


Hebrews 1 NWT
4So he has become better than the angels, to the extent that he has inherited a name more excellent than theirs.

The Son could only inherit from His Father what His Father Himself possessed.

What name did the Father possess which the Son inherited ?

Just answer the question James.

LeClerc
JamesJah

What is the difference between a first bourn son and the other sons?

Can a son become a father of his father?

Do people who love tradition have no regard for what pleases their creator the ruler of the universe?
Honey 56

JamesJah wrote:
What do Trinitarians make of these  scriptures????

What/who is a trinitarian? more man made teaching from the WTBTS?

Psalm 83:18
That people may know that you, whose name is Jehovah, You alone are the Most High over all the earth.



“Hear, O Israel:
The Lord (YHWH)  our God (El-O-Him/Plural)
The Lord (YHWH)  is one (Echad/united)


I never get fed up with posting this to you James

I pray that one day it might just sink in.  

Honey
Honey 56

bnabernard wrote:
Is Yeshua/Jesus the Messiah.

bernard (hug)


Errrrr? Is this a trick question bernard?

Honey
Honey 56

To James.
How many times does the word 'Prototokos' appear in the scriptures?
Who does it refer to?
and
What does it mean?

Honey
JamesJah

Honey 56 wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
What do Trinitarians make of these  scriptures????

What/who is a trinitarian? more man made teaching from the WTBTS?

Psalm 83:18
That people may know that you, whose name is Jehovah, You alone are the Most High over all the earth.



“Hear, O Israel:
The Lord (YHWH)  our God (El-O-Him/Plural)
The Lord (YHWH)  is one (Echad/united)


I never get fed up with posting this to you James

I pray that one day it might just sink in.  

Honey


This might just come as a little surprise to you Honey but I must say at the outset most

Trinitarians do ignore it, and that is in the old Hebrew language they would express greatness by using the plurality of a title because they did not have different words to express it.
The Hebrews have the same problem with authority in the heavens which are numbered in there order of importance rather than give them a different name.

Then most Trinitarians take advantage of peoples ignorance of these matters to keep them happy with the false teaching of the trinity.
LeClerc

Hi James

JamesJah wrote:

Can a son become a father of his father?


What does a Father need to have been before he can become a Father.

This is very important since you have already posted

Psalm 83:18
That people may know that you, whose name is Jehovah, You alone are the Most High over all the earth.

Hebrews 1 NWT
4So he has become better than the angels, to the extent that he has inherited a name more excellent than theirs.

The Son could only inherit from His Father what His Father Himself possessed.

What name did the Father possess which the Son inherited ?

LeClerc
bnabernard

What does a Father need to have been before he can become a Father.


Almighty.

bernard (hug)
JamesJah

The first bourn inherits full power all the others in a family inherit to a lesser degree, Trinitarian gobble de gook can change all that  make a god out of the spirit and hey presto we have invented a trinity, is that clever?

Do you also do Christmas?
LeClerc

Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
What does a Father need to have been before he can become a Father.


Almighty.

bernard (hug)


Can the Almighty be Almighty if He was destitute of Word and Wisdom.

LeClerc
bnabernard

LeClerc wrote:
Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
What does a Father need to have been before he can become a Father.


Almighty.

bernard (hug)


Can the Almighty be Almighty if He was destitute of Word and Wisdom.

LeClerc


Almighty Leclerc, lets face it, there ain't nowt that's going to better that, not even a scratch of the 'ead and a ''how's that'' question.

bernard (hug)
LeClerc

Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
What does a Father need to have been before he can become a Father.


Almighty.

bernard (hug)


Can the Almighty be Almighty if He was destitute of Word and Wisdom.

LeClerc


Almighty Leclerc, lets face it, there ain't nowt that's going to better that, not even a scratch of the 'ead and a ''how's that'' question.

bernard (hug)


Does that mean you can't answer the question ?

LeClerc
bnabernard

Of course I can't answer the question, How do I know what almighty has up it's sleeve, do you have the absolute on almighty other than all things are possible when you are the almighty?

bernard (hug)
LeClerc

Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
Of course I can't answer the question, How do I know what almighty has up it's sleeve, do you have the absolute on almighty other than all things are possible when you are the almighty?

bernard (hug)


Through the Scriptures The Almighty reveals that He lacks nothing, therefore He must never have been destitute of Word and Wisdom, since He has never been destitute of His Logos, that means the Logos was not created but has always existed and if always existing the Logos must be YHWH since only YHWH existed in the beginning.

LeClerc
bnabernard

Claptrap    Leclerk, almighty is something you cannot create in your image by saying it must have this or must have that esppecialy if almighty has something better. Do you think you can determine what almighty is and must have? Don't be suprised if you calculate wrongly becuase when the almighty replies and says I did not need that becuase I have this instead'
you'll simply have to go oh.

When God is the law and wisdom etc whatever it might be is God then the law and God are one, now if Gods word is the law don't expect to know all law, because the law is as many as snowflakes in their own form.

bernard (hug)
LeClerc

Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
Claptrap    Leclerk, almighty is something you cannot create in your image by saying it must have this or must have that esppecialy if almighty has something better. Do you think you can determine what almighty is and must have? Don't be suprised if you calculate wrongly becuase when the almighty replies and says I did not need that becuase I have this instead'
you'll simply have to go oh.

When God is the law and wisdom etc whatever it might be is God then the law and God are one, now if Gods word is the law don't expect to know all law, because the law is as many as snowflakes in their own form.

bernard (hug)


It's not what I'm saying Bernie, its what YHWH has revealed through the scriptures.

John 1
1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

1 John 1
1 That which was from the beginning, which we have heard, which we have seen with our eyes, which we have looked at and our hands have touched—this we proclaim concerning the Word of life. 2 The life appeared; we have seen it and testify to it, and we proclaim to you the eternal life, which was with the Father and has appeared to us.

If you want to pick a fight with the scriptures that's your choice.

LeClerc
Honey 56

To James,

How many times does the word Prototokos appear in the scriptures?
Who does it refer to?
and
What does it mean?

Honey
bnabernard

So they've seen the eternal life, were they the first or had anybody in the past seen it, what is eternal life, what does eternal life look like, does eternal life die?

bernard (hug)
LeClerc

bnabernard wrote:
So they've seen the eternal life, were they the first or had anybody in the past seen it, what is eternal life, what does eternal life look like, does eternal life die?

bernard (hug)


Genesis 17
1 When Abram was ninety-nine years old, YHWH appeared to Abram and said to him, “I am Almighty God; walk before Me and be blameless.

LeClerc
bnabernard

So you can't answer the question then?

bernard (hug)
Honey 56

JamesJah wrote:



This might just come as a little surprise to you Honey but I must say at the outset most

Trinitarians do ignore it, and that is in the old Hebrew language they would express greatness by using the plurality of a title because they did not have different words to express it.
The Hebrews have the same problem with authority in the heavens which are numbered in there order of importance rather than give them a different name.

Then most Trinitarians take advantage of peoples ignorance of these matters to keep them happy with the false teaching of the trinity
.



In the beginning God (El-o-Him/plural) created........
Genesis  1


In the beginning was the Word,and the word was with God, and the Word was God,. He was with God in the beginning. Through Him all things were made, without him nothing was made that has been made.

Warning.
The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it!
John 1.



“Hear, O Israel:
The Lord (YHWH)  our God (El-O-Him/Plural)
The Lord (YHWH)  is one (Echad/united)


I never get fed up with posting this to you James

I pray that one day it might just sink in.  

I would never take advamtage of your ignorance James, just trying to alleviate you of it.
BTW. what is a trinitarian?

Honey
LeClerc

Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
So you can't answer the question then?

bernard (hug)


The scriptures have answered your question.

Do you have a problem with scripture ?

LeClerc
JamesJah

Who has a problem with scripture??????????????????        



Who can not explain the great Sabbeth who is putting up a smoke screeeeen????
Honey 56

James,
your OP is about YHWH's sabbath.
And despite being asked you have not explained how one should enter into this rest?

Could you perhaps use the scriptures to explain this?
Thank you.

Honey
JamesJah

You will be finding it quite difficult Honey, simply because you think you know best and you must do things your way, when to get into the Sabbath of Jehovah you have to give up you way and do what he requires of some one on his Sabbath day.

Jehovah’s Sabbath runs on for the rest of the Millennium, worked out yet what this Sabbath is?
Honey 56

JamesJah wrote:
You will be finding it quite difficult Honey, simply because you think you know best and you must do things your way, when to get into the Sabbath of Jehovah you have to give up you way and do what he requires of some one on his Sabbath day.

Jehovah’s Sabbath runs on for the rest of the Millennium, worked out yet what this Sabbath is?


Yes James,
But what must we do, according to scripture, to enter into it?
and
How many times does thw word 'prototokos' appear in scripture?
Who does it refer to?
and
What does it mean?

Honey
JamesJah

Gnat and camel come to mind Honey ==159 times now can we all move on??

James 4:17
Therefore, if one knows how to do what is right and yet does not do it, it is a sin for him.
LeClerc

Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
Be a foot step follower of the leader LerClerc.


According to your teaching James, is your leader an Elohiym other than YHWH Elohiym ?

Jeremiah 25 NWT
6And do not walk after other gods in order to serve them and to bow down to them, that ​YOU​ may not offend me with the work of ​YOUR​ hands, and that I may not cause calamity to ​YOU.’

Now James you have posted

JamesJah wrote:
Therefore, let us do our best to enter that rest; so that no one will fall short because of the same kind of disobedience.


According to your understanding of who Y'shua is your quoted first step of obedience is a step of disobedience according to the prophet Jeremiah.

According to your own teaching you have disqualified yourself from entering the most important Sabbath, the subjest of this thread, because of disobedience by following, according to your understanding, other gods.

LeClerc
Honey 56

Quote:
[quote="JamesJah:81118"]Gnat and camel come to mind Honey ==159 times now can we all move on



No  James, You say Gnat and camel. do you even comprehend that saying from the scriptures?

This is a matter of life and death (literally)

So what must we do, according to scripture, to enter into YHWH's sabbath?
(If you do not know, then you are in serious trouble!, but we can help)

and

How many times does the word 'prototokos' appear in scripture?
Who does it refer to?
and
What does it mean?  
(This will answer your question concerning the uniqueness of  Messiah Yeshua)

Honey
Honey 56

bnabernard wrote:
Quarts into pint pots again.

Flesh is creation just like a fridge.

bernard (hug)


What did you mean when you posted this Bernard....?

Quote:
The Jew had God in a box, the law, this was to make them as one body a son of God, Yeshua came, then there was God in a body of flesh.


Did you mean what you posted; Yeshua Son of God came and then there was God in a body of flesh?

How could The Word/Logos who was God/El-O-Him/YHWH who created everything that was ever made, be a creation Himself?

If indeed that is what you are saying, that Yeshua the Messiah is a created being?

Honey
JamesJah

Nice day LerClerc

Shame about America is it not?

I think it is Honey that keeps telling us that Christians are not under law but undeserved kindness, but by the way you keep posting law at me it does look like you disagree is that correct or are you just being pedantic?
Honey 56

Quote:
[quote="JamesJah:81136"]

Shame about America is it not?


It is a great shame that yet again America has been hit by a hurricane, and instead of thiinking that this is God's judgement, perhaps the Christian thing would be to pray for these unfortunate people, a) that they will come to know their Lord and  Saviour (because Messiah Yeshua gave His life for them too)
and b) that YHWH will use those who do know their Lord and Saviour to help comfort them in their time of great need.

Quote:
I think it is Honey that keeps telling us that Christians are not under law but undeserved kindness, but by the way you keep posting law at me it does look like you disagree is that correct or are you just being pedantic


True Christians are under Grace James, or as the scriptures say 'not by works, so that no man may boast'.
Because of thier obedience they have entered into YHWH's sabbath and do not walk after other 'gods' besides YHWH.

Honey
JamesJah

So no man made Trinity then Honey?

When do you think this prophecy should take place?

Revelation 11:18
The nations became wrathful, and your own wrath came, and the appointed time for the dead to be judged.

To give [their] reward to your slaves the prophets and to the holy ones and to those fearing your name, the small and the great, and to bring to ruin those ruining the earth..
Honey 56

Quote:
[quote="JamesJah:81143"]So no man made Trinity then Honey?


Absolutely not, but then you have been told this until one of us is blue in the face!

The Godhead, according to scripture, not man made teaching.

Quote:
Revelation 11:18
The nations became wrathful, and your own wrath came, and the appointed time for the dead to be judged.

To give [their] reward to your slaves the prophets and to the holy ones and to those fearing your name, the small and the great, and to bring to ruin those ruining the earth..


Do you think that the dead are being judged right now James?

If so perhaps it is time to return to biblical teaching!

Honey
bnabernard

Honey 56 wrote:
bnabernard wrote:
Quarts into pint pots again.

Flesh is creation just like a fridge.

bernard (hug)


What did you mean when you posted this Bernard....?

Quote:
The Jew had God in a box, the law, this was to make them as one body a son of God, Yeshua came, then there was God in a body of flesh.


Did you mean what you posted; Yeshua Son of God came and then there was God in a body of flesh?

How could The Word/Logos who was God/El-O-Him/YHWH who created everything that was ever made, be a creation Himself?

If indeed that is what you are saying, that Yeshua the Messiah is a created being?

Honey


When considering the Lilly we consider a flower, and it need not be the Lilly, what we are considering is creation without free will.
The Lilly obeys the law as there is no will to do otherwise, the law determines the Lilly it will complete its cycle.

Man on the other hand has free will and is able to aknowledge the law then do something of his own choosing that 'breaks the law'.

However law cannot be brocken only rules can be brocken, by what we term as a breaking of the law we shunt a law and make room for another law to enter the picture and conflict among the set laws takes place.

To fly a plane we break the law of gravity, and to do that we introduce other laws which in turn lead to pollution the unatural speed that a person journeys e break up of close knit society and from one breaking of law that in itself is rooted elswhere in history countless laws are displaced and new unatural laws come into play.

Now coming to the son of God Jesus, he was a created flesh and blood body not under the lawbreaking ilk of the rest of humanity, he was as is oft attested a 'new Adam' free from the error of self determination.

Jesus held to the law, obeyed the rules, did not question why he should not do something nor question qwhy he should do something.
Jesus epitimised one who stuck to the rules and as he stuck to the rules he did not incur any side affects caused by erring from the path set by God the Father in His guideline to man.

Jesus held the law and the law was God. Did Jesus know all law, know he knew the rules and that the outcome of ignoring the rules would lead to unfortunate happenings detremental to his own wellbeing.

Like a fridge has an ice compartment, sufficient for its needs so Jesus had sufficient for his needs. An example I have used is the ennuite, they have to protect themselves from to much and use sufficient for their needs and Alaska like the law far to much to comprehend especialy as it is made up of many individual snowflakes, like the law is many fold.

God in a box, the Box behind the curtain, the law, sufficient for mans needs but outside the box and in the hands of man becomes corrupted and destroyed as alternative laws are brought into play.

I mentioned the euphrates, there are a number of dams causing disruption and hardship, are the laws regarding the euphrates being brocken, are the laws spirits that have been called away.

Which leads us to how many laws are overseen by spirits.


Perfect creation in exchange for imperfect creation, Jesus/Yeshua the perfect for the imperfect and an example to fallen spirits that themselves have the clock ticking.

Which in turn leads to the question, why was Noah outnumbered by spirits and how did those spirits survive without bodies, and lest we think there was but a few, remember a legion cast into the swine.

bernard (hug)
JamesJah

Don’t your brain do summersaults Berne hope you get it all straitened out one day, I am still wondering where this God Head is in the bible specially when the son hands over the Kingdom to his Father?

I have one Almighty God who is above all the gods

I have a son of God whose Father is greater than he, but who has been raised to the next most exalted position.

Then we have Holy Spirit with which 144,000 came to be anointed so they could also be joint heirs of with Christ if they held their faith till the end.

Romans 8:16, 17
The spirit itself bears witness with our spirit that we are God’s children. If, then, we are children, we are also heirs: heirs indeed of God, but joint heirs with Christ, provided we suffer together that we may also be glorified together.

So what sort of God head is that?
Honey 56

James asks.....

Quote:
I am still wondering where this God Head is in the bible specially when the son hands over the Kingdom to his Father?


Then wonder no more James.....

For in him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily.
Colossians 2


Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device
Acts  17


For the invisible things of him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even his eternal power and Godhead; so that they are without excuse
Romans 1


for in him all the fulness of the Godhead was pleased to dwell
Colossians 1


You're welcome  

Honey
JamesJah

You are happy to be fooled by your own translation; but you choose not to be fooled by the truth that’s quite normal in this world Honey

Colossians 2:9, 10
It is in him that all the fullness of the divine quality dwells bodily. And so you are possessed of fullness by means of him, who is the head of all government and authority.
Honey 56

JamesJah wrote:
You are happy to be fooled by your own translation; but you choose not to be fooled by the truth that’s quite normal in this world Honey

Colossians 2:9, 10
It is in him that all the fullness of the divine quality dwells bodily. And so you are possessed of fullness by means of him, who is the head of all government and authority.





Colossians 2:9, 10
It is in him that all the fullness of the **divine quality dwells bodily. And so you are possessed of fullness by means of him, who is the head of all government and authority


**theotés: deity
Original Word: θεότης, ητος, ἡ
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: theotés
Phonetic Spelling: (theh-ot'-ace)
Short Definition: deity, Godhead
Definition: deity, Godhead.



Honey
JamesJah

Not in my Interlinear it is not Honey so where did you get your translation from?
LeClerc

Morning James

JamesJah wrote:
Be a foot step follower of the leader LerClerc.


According to your teaching James, is your leader an Elohiym other than YHWH Elohiym ?

Jeremiah 25 NWT
6And do not walk after other gods in order to serve them and to bow down to them, that ​YOU​ may not offend me with the work of ​YOUR​ hands, and that I may not cause calamity to ​YOU.’

Now James you have posted

JamesJah wrote:
Therefore, let us do our best to enter that rest; so that no one will fall short because of the same kind of disobedience.


According to your understanding of who Y'shua is your quoted first step of obedience is a step of disobedience according to the prophet Jeremiah.

According to your own teaching you have disqualified yourself from entering the most important Sabbath, the subjest of this thread, because of disobedience by following, according to your understanding, other gods.

Y'shua was born of a woman and kept Torah but according to your understanding of who He is you nullify this.

LeClerc
bnabernard

Le Clerc

Are you expected to follow the teaching of a high priest elected by God?

bernard (hug)
JamesJah

LerClerc

  I see you are still juggling the torah is that because you still think it is in force?

To me there is only one most high God who is must be obeyed without question even the gods have to obey him.

Psalm 82:1, 2
God is stationing himself in the assembly of the Divine One; In the middle of the gods he judges:  How long will YOU keep on judging with injustice And showing partiality to the wicked themselves?
Honey 56

JamesJah wrote:
Not in my Interlinear it is not Honey so where did you get your translation from?


Would it surprise you to know that you can go on any good bible site on the internet or purchase any interlinear or concordance or lexicon from a reputable book store and still recieve the same definition of that word?

Perhaps the question should be, is the translation that you are using a fair and unbiased one?
Many of us already know the answer to that one James.

Honey
LeClerc

Hi James

JamesJah wrote:
LerClerc

  I see you are still juggling the torah is that because you still think it is in force?

To me there is only one most high God who is must be obeyed without question even the gods have to obey him.

Psalm 82:1, 2
God is stationing himself in the assembly of the Divine One; In the middle of the gods he judges:  How long will YOU keep on judging with injustice And showing partiality to the wicked themselves?


Did Y'shua keep the Torah ?

According to your understanding of who He is, no.  

According to the scriptures yes.  

That is the important difference.

Has heaven and earth passed away James ?

LeClerc
JamesJah

Your limited knowledge of the heavens does allow you some strange questions LerClerc.

2 Peter 3:5-7
For, according to their wish, this fact escapes their notice, that there were heavens from of old and an earth standing compactly out of water and in the midst of water by the word of God; and by those [means] the world of that time suffered destruction when it was deluged with water. But by the same word the heavens and the earth that are now are stored up for fire and are being reserved to the Day of Judgment and of destruction of the ungodly men.
LeClerc

Hi James

JamesJah wrote:
Your limited knowledge of the heavens does allow you some strange questions LerClerc.

2 Peter 3:5-7
For, according to their wish, this fact escapes their notice, that there were heavens from of old and an earth standing compactly out of water and in the midst of water by the word of God; and by those [means] the world of that time suffered destruction when it was deluged with water. But by the same word the heavens and the earth that are now are stored up for fire and are being reserved to the Day of Judgment and of destruction of the ungodly men.


Really James

Matthew 5
17 “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. 19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Now James

JamesJah wrote:
LerClerc

  I see you are still juggling the torah is that because you still think it is in force?

To me there is only one most high God who is must be obeyed without question even the gods have to obey him.

Psalm 82:1, 2
God is stationing himself in the assembly of the Divine One; In the middle of the gods he judges:  How long will YOU keep on judging with injustice And showing partiality to the wicked themselves?


Did Y'shua keep the Torah ?

According to your understanding of who He is, no.  

According to the scriptures yes.  

That is the important difference.

Has heaven and earth passed away as spoken by Y'shua ?

LeClerc[
bnabernard

Torah pretty much sumed up in one God and do unto others, then we get to the bit were evrybody is his sister his brother and his mother and father, has he done away with marriage at this point?

bernard (hug)
JamesJah

LeClerc wrote:
Hi James

JamesJah wrote:
Your limited knowledge of the heavens does allow you some strange questions LerClerc.

2 Peter 3:5-7
For, according to their wish, this fact escapes their notice, that there were heavens from of old and an earth standing compactly out of water and in the midst of water by the word of God; and by those [means] the world of that time suffered destruction when it was deluged with water. But by the same word the heavens and the earth that are now are stored up for fire and are being reserved to the Day of Judgment and of destruction of the ungodly men.


Really James

Matthew 5
17 “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. 19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Now James

JamesJah wrote:
LerClerc

  I see you are still juggling the torah is that because you still think it is in force?

To me there is only one most high God who is must be obeyed without question even the gods have to obey him.

Psalm 82:1, 2
God is stationing himself in the assembly of the Divine One; In the middle of the gods he judges:  How long will YOU keep on judging with injustice And showing partiality to the wicked themselves?


Did Y'shua keep the Torah ?

According to your understanding of who He is, no.  

According to the scriptures yes.  

That is the important difference.

Has heaven and earth passed away as spoken by Y'shua ?

LeClerc[


This is where it pays to know your heavens, is it not?
LeClerc

Hi James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hi James

JamesJah wrote:
Your limited knowledge of the heavens does allow you some strange questions LerClerc.

2 Peter 3:5-7
For, according to their wish, this fact escapes their notice, that there were heavens from of old and an earth standing compactly out of water and in the midst of water by the word of God; and by those [means] the world of that time suffered destruction when it was deluged with water. But by the same word the heavens and the earth that are now are stored up for fire and are being reserved to the Day of Judgment and of destruction of the ungodly men.


Really James

Matthew 5
17 “Do not think that I came to destroy the Law or the Prophets. I did not come to destroy but to fulfill. 18 For assuredly, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, one jot or one tittle will by no means pass from the law till all is fulfilled. 19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Now James

JamesJah wrote:
LerClerc

  I see you are still juggling the torah is that because you still think it is in force?

To me there is only one most high God who is must be obeyed without question even the gods have to obey him.

Psalm 82:1, 2
God is stationing himself in the assembly of the Divine One; In the middle of the gods he judges:  How long will YOU keep on judging with injustice And showing partiality to the wicked themselves?


Did Y'shua keep the Torah ?

According to your understanding of who He is, no.  

According to the scriptures yes.  

That is the important difference.

Has heaven and earth passed away as spoken by Y'shua ?

LeClerc[


This is where it pays to know your heavens, is it not?


Is the earth still here which Y'shua walked upon 2000 years ago ?

LeClerc
JamesJah

Yes LerClerc the planet is still here but the sea of mankind or the old earth is not.

It pays to read the WT once in a while it helps us with bible terminology something the hell fire preachers lost track of.

Isaiah 57:20, 21
But the wicked are like the sea that is being tossed, when it is unable to calm down, the waters of which keep tossing up seaweed and mire. There is no peace,” my God has said, for the wicked ones.
LeClerc

Hi James

JamesJah wrote:
Yes LerClerc the planet is still here but the sea of mankind or the old earth is not.

It pays to read the WT once in a while it helps us with bible terminology something the hell fire preachers lost track of.

Isaiah 57:20, 21
But the wicked are like the sea that is being tossed, when it is unable to calm down, the waters of which keep tossing up seaweed and mire. There is no peace,” my God has said, for the wicked ones.


Check out the Greek word translated ''earth'' James.

Yes James the planet is still here.

LeClerc
bnabernard

The greek are they the ones who follow Yah Zeus?

bernard (hug)
LeClerc

Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
The greek are they the ones who follow Yah Zeus?

bernard (hug)


No it was the lingua franca of the day in which the Messianic Writings were written, but with Hebraic mindset.

LeClerc
JamesJah

What was Adam made of?
bnabernard

LeClerc wrote:
Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
The greek are they the ones who follow Yah Zeus?

bernard (hug)


No it was the lingua franca of the day in which the Messianic Writings were written, but with Hebraic mindset.

LeClerc


Ah, the ones who went on to follow Yah Zues?

bernard (hug)
LeClerc

Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
The greek are they the ones who follow Yah Zeus?

bernard (hug)


No it was the lingua franca of the day in which the Messianic Writings were written, but with Hebraic mindset.

LeClerc


Ah, the ones who went on to follow Yah Zues?

bernard (hug)


No Bernie unless you are saying John who penned one of the Gospels followed Zues.



LeClerc
LeClerc

Hi James

JamesJah wrote:
What was Adam made of?


Now James you must be getting desperate.

Aphar of adamah

Not

Aphar of erets

LeClerc
LeClerc

Hi James

Lets get this back on track James

JamesJah wrote:
Become an imitator of Christ a doer of the word and not a hearer only.

Hebrews 5:9
after he had been made perfect he became responsible for everlasting salvation to all those obeying him,


Now we are getting closer James.

What is the first step of obedience for those who believe that Y'shua is Israel's Messiah, the Son of YHWH, the one Moses wrote about in the Torah, and about whom the prophets also wrote

LeClerc
bnabernard

LeClerc wrote:
Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
The greek are they the ones who follow Yah Zeus?

bernard (hug)


No it was the lingua franca of the day in which the Messianic Writings were written, but with Hebraic mindset.

LeClerc


Ah, the ones who went on to follow Yah Zues?

bernard (hug)


No Bernie unless you are saying John who penned one of the Gospels followed Zues.



LeClerc


Are you sugesting that John refered to the son of God as Iesous=hail zeus

bernard (hug)
LeClerc

Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hi Bernie

bnabernard wrote:
The greek are they the ones who follow Yah Zeus?

bernard (hug)


No it was the lingua franca of the day in which the Messianic Writings were written, but with Hebraic mindset.

LeClerc


Ah, the ones who went on to follow Yah Zues?

bernard (hug)


No Bernie unless you are saying John who penned one of the Gospels followed Zues.



LeClerc


Are you sugesting that John refered to the son of God as Iesous=hail zeus

bernard (hug)


No Bernie he followed the Septuagint's transliteration of the Messiah's name into Greek.

Yĕhowshuwa 1
10 καὶ ἐνετείλατο καὶ ἐνετείλατο Ἰησοῦς τοῖς γραμματεῦσιν τοῦ λαοῦ λέγων
τοῖς γραμματεῦσιν τοῦ λαοῦ λέγων

LeClerc
bnabernard

The board seems to have had a problem with how translations/transliterations should be recieved and stressed that there is an importance in accuracy.

Now I'm sure the anti christ would not be a reflection in any false translations?

It would appear and you would seem to agree that one should use the correct translation of the name of the son of God, which would appear to be Yoshuah/Joshuah.
Do you have that understanding and if not why do you use Y'shua, and why the use of (') between the Y and s.

There is some agency's that suggest Yahshuah have you any thoughts or explanations?

bernard (hug)
LeClerc

Hi Bernie
bnabernard wrote:
Do you have that understanding and if not why do you use Y'shua, and why the use of (') between the Y and s.
bernard (hug)


So as not to cause further division Bernie. Let the reader understand.

LeClerc
Honey 56

bnabernard wrote:
The board seems to have had a problem with how translations/transliterations should be recieved and stressed that there is an importance in accuracy.

Now I'm sure the anti christ would not be a reflection in any false translations?

It would appear and you would seem to agree that one should use the correct translation of the name of the son of God, which would appear to be Yoshuah/Joshuah.
Do you have that understanding and if not why do you use Y'shua, and why the use of (') between the Y and s.

There is some agency's that suggest Yahshuah have you any thoughts or explanations?

bernard (hug)




Surely God is my *salvation; I will trust and not be afraid. The LORD, the LORD, is my strength and my song; he has become my *salvation
Isaiah 12

*yeshuah: salvation
Original Word: יְשׁוּעָה
Part of Speech: Noun Feminine
Transliteration: yeshuah
Phonetic Spelling: (yesh-oo'-aw)
Short Definition: salvation

(with thanks to LeClerc    )
bnabernard

http://yeshuah.com/

http://www.thenazareneway.com/yeshua_jesus_real_name.htm
Honey 56

Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved."
Acts 4:12

She will give birth to a son, and you are to give him the name Jesus, because he will save his people from their sins
Matthew 1:21

       nglreturns.myfreeforum.org Forum Index -> Christian chat Page 1, 2  Next
Page 1 of 2
Create your own free forum | Buy a domain to use with your forum