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I am not an Idiot:
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Farmer Geddon
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Joined: 27 Aug 2008
Posts: 4107



PostPosted: Thu Sep 22, 2011 2:01 pm    Post subject: I am not an Idiot:  Reply with quote

Kate Smurthwaite tells it as it is.


Link


Quote:
If a judge convicted someone without evidence to their guilt because he had a deep personal conviction that they were guilty, that judge would uncontroversially be described as an idiot.

If a carpenter started cutting timber without measuring because he had a deep personal conviction that he had selected the right place to cut, that carpenter would uncontroversially be described as an idiot.

If a driver reversed into traffic without looking because he had a deep personal conviction that the road was clear, that driver would uncontroversially be described as an idiot.

And so on. Everyone here could make up their own examples. There are potentially an infinite number of them. Because there is only one area of "knowledge" where faith trumps evidence. Only one area where failure to check your opinions against reality is regarded as a virtue. Religion.


"It is wrong in all cases to believe on insufficient evidence; and where it is presumption to doubt and to investigate, there it is worse than presumption to believe."
-W.K. Clifford



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Shrub Dweller
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Joined: 26 Jul 2011
Posts: 387



PostPosted: Mon Sep 26, 2011 9:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The question arises, why do people believe such things, things which run against the evidence or common sense ? Where have they got this from ?

One thing is true here, is that, they are starting with the conclusion and presupposition and then fitting the argument, evidence (?) and preconditions to suit their desired outcome. This surprizingly is a very common process in mankind (mainly unconscious) and which further begs the question, what evolutionary advantage does it impart on such a being as man ?
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Boss Cat
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Joined: 15 Sep 2011
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Location: it's good here

PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 2:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well there is a book about this, actually, whose title and author I've forgotten I nearly got it out of the library the other day but had too many already.  

Is faith is the new kid on the block, in human evolution (or animal come to that) or is it a dying remnant from earlier stages?  I gather that people with religious faith tend to have more kids, they're more successful in evolutionary terms, in this country at least.  Seeing as he is the topic of another thread Dawkins springs to mind; having two wives and one kid is not a massive evolutionary success is it, really.  But for all I know he might have kids all over the place.

I dunno, my friend says he's ugly, but I think he's hansome, especially for a bloke his age.  I quite fancy him myself, but at my age anything's not too bad.  Shame about his naff squeaky voice though.

I suppose in terms of evolutionary success bacteria have got us all beaten.  No faith, no reason, no science, no curiosity but they do all right.

Incidentally, according to the sole criterion references in the clip I'm an idiot.  Does she mean technically or was this vulgar abuse?
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cymrudynnion
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Joined: 13 Jun 2011
Posts: 1208



PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:37 pm    Post subject: Re: I am not an Idiot: Reply with quote

Farmer Geddon wrote:
Kate Smurthwaite tells it as it is.


Link


Quote:
If a judge convicted someone without evidence to their guilt because he had a deep personal conviction that they were guilty, that judge would uncontroversially be described as an idiot.

If a carpenter started cutting timber without measuring because he had a deep personal conviction that he had selected the right place to cut, that carpenter would uncontroversially be described as an idiot.

If a driver reversed into traffic without looking because he had a deep personal conviction that the road was clear, that driver would uncontroversially be described as an idiot.

And so on. Everyone here could make up their own examples. There are potentially an infinite number of them. Because there is only one area of "knowledge" where faith trumps evidence. Only one area where failure to check your opinions against reality is regarded as a virtue. Religion.


"It is wrong in all cases to believe on insufficient evidence; and where it is presumption to doubt and to investigate, there it is worse than presumption to believe."
-W.K. Clifford



There is a chef I think in London he holds multiple Michelin stars in his kitchen he has no scales to weigh ingredients and no timers or clocks to guage the cooking. All done by by deep personal conviction and he gets it right every time. Check out Masterchef if you don't believe me
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Farmer Geddon
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I will do - once you give us a clue who this Chef is...

Actually ignore the rhetoric - what is this Chefs' name?
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Pukon_the_Treen
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Joined: 23 Oct 2008
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Location: Witch-cursed, legend-haunted Arkham

PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
All done by by deep personal conviction and he gets it right every time.


It's probably experience, training and knowledge rather than a deep personal conviction.
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Farmer Geddon
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Joined: 27 Aug 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 27, 2011 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well I was going for the; to be impressed if this miracle Chef, who has multiple Michelin stars, was in the only cook in the kitchen Pu.

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Boss Cat
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 5:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Experience eh?
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Boss Cat
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Location: it's good here

PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2011 11:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Incidentally, what kind of jurisdiction does Clifford live under?  I didn't know that  judges found anyone guilty or convicted anyone as such.  I thought they made decisions on points of law and sentenced when the jury had decided on guilt.  And I thought sentencing was according to existing legal guidelines, not personal gut feeling.
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Shrub Dweller
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Joined: 26 Jul 2011
Posts: 387



PostPosted: Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Boss Cat wrote:

Incidentally, according to the sole criterion references in the clip I'm an idiot.
 You take something to be true and a fact without any proof ?

Quote:
Does she mean technically or was this vulgar abuse?

I would think both.



Last edited by Shrub Dweller on Sun Oct 02, 2011 6:18 pm; edited 1 time in total
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