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What does equal mean?
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cyberman
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Joined: 23 Mar 2011
Posts: 3750


Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 6:10 pm    Post subject:  Reply with quote

JamesJah wrote:
cyberman wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
cyberman wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
Who is it that only believes in one God, Is that not saying I believe in one human?

Do they say which one it is they believe in?

 


It is like saying I believ in one human, grammatically and mathematically. Most people, however, believ in billions of humans.

Yes they do say which one it is they believe in. "Creator of heavan and Earth, of all things visible and invisible.."


that still does not cover it according to scripture all the creation after the son was the job of the son under the direction of the Father..


this is a complete change of subject. We were talking about whether people, like Popes and others who use the Nicene Creed, believe in one God or more than one God.

You seem to have changed the subject to whether or not they are right to believe in only one God.


It is a question off equal, is Jesus equal with his father fore example?

Leclerec keeps thinking he has a technicality that says that he is, which in reality he is not because he plainly says that he is not.

One does not always bow in worship as the bible shows in many places.


My question to you was about the error which you say Popes have made in believeing in more than one God. I said to you that they believe in only one God. Initially you argued against this, but now you seem to be admitting that they do only believe in one God but that they are wrong to do so.

Can you clarify your position about Popes for me please. Not Popes generally - I don't want to launch a rant! - but specifically these three questions, please:

How many gods do Popes claim to believe in?
How many gods do you think they actually believe in?
How many gods do you think they ought to believe in?

You also referred to an error which modern Popes have made which medieval Popes did not make. What was that error, please?

Thank you.
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JamesJah
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Joined: 30 Aug 2011
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Location: Sheppey

PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2014 8:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cyberman wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
cyberman wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
cyberman wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
Who is it that only believes in one God, Is that not saying I believe in one human?

Do they say which one it is they believe in?

 


It is like saying I believ in one human, grammatically and mathematically. Most people, however, believ in billions of humans.

Yes they do say which one it is they believe in. "Creator of heavan and Earth, of all things visible and invisible.."


that still does not cover it according to scripture all the creation after the son was the job of the son under the direction of the Father..


this is a complete change of subject. We were talking about whether people, like Popes and others who use the Nicene Creed, believe in one God or more than one God.

You seem to have changed the subject to whether or not they are right to believe in only one God.


It is a question off equal, is Jesus equal with his father fore example?

Leclerec keeps thinking he has a technicality that says that he is, which in reality he is not because he plainly says that he is not.

One does not always bow in worship as the bible shows in many places.


My question to you was about the error which you say Popes have made in believeing in more than one God. I said to you that they believe in only one God. Initially you argued against this, but now you seem to be admitting that they do only believe in one God but that they are wrong to do so.

Can you clarify your position about Popes for me please. Not Popes generally - I don't want to launch a rant! - but specifically these three questions, please:

How many gods do Popes claim to believe in?
How many gods do you think they actually believe in?
How many gods do you think they ought to believe in?

You also referred to an error which modern Popes have made which medieval Popes did not make. What was that error, please?

Thank you.


 The Popes have made the problem of understanding which god is which or how many when they constituted the Trinity, that doctrine was to explain why there can be more than one God but there only being one God, the three leaf clover being used as an example of their reasoning.

The doctrine was constituted at the council of Nicaea until today.

Now if you wish me to explain that I am afraid I do not view things as they do I view things from what the scriptures teach, the three leaf clover is one of their ways of having three gods but only one God, not only do I see two gods but I see one who is greater than the other.

Why not find a Pope that can answer your question?
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LeClerc
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Joined: 31 May 2012
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 9:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:


Now if you can get some bible terminology correct you will see that the statement Jehovah makes means all Christians must only worship one God not all of them.

Deuteronomy 12:2-5
You should completely destroy all the places where the nations you will dispossess have served their gods, whether on the high mountains or on the hills or under any luxuriant tree. 

You should pull down their altars, shatter their sacred pillars, burn their sacred poles in the fire, and cut down the graven images of their gods, obliterating their very names from that place.

You must not worship Jehovah your God in that way. Rather, seek Jehovah your God wherever he chooses to establish his name and his place of residence among all your tribes, and go there.



Lets examine some Bible terminology James

Exodus 34 NWT
14  You must not bow down to another god, for Jehovah is known for requiring exclusive devotion.* Yes, he is a God who requires exclusive devotion.

Matthew 14 NWT
31  Immediately stretching out his hand, Jesus caught hold of him and said to him: “You with little faith, why did you give way to doubt?”+32  After they got up into the boat, the windstorm abated.33  Then those in the boat did obeisance* to him, saying: “You really are God’s Son.”

* Or “bowed down.”

Regards

LeClerc
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JamesJah
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Location: Sheppey

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:


Now if you can get some bible terminology correct you will see that the statement Jehovah makes means all Christians must only worship one God not all of them.

Deuteronomy 12:2-5
You should completely destroy all the places where the nations you will dispossess have served their gods, whether on the high mountains or on the hills or under any luxuriant tree. 

You should pull down their altars, shatter their sacred pillars, burn their sacred poles in the fire, and cut down the graven images of their gods, obliterating their very names from that place.

You must not worship Jehovah your God in that way. Rather, seek Jehovah your God wherever he chooses to establish his name and his place of residence among all your tribes, and go there.



Lets examine some Bible terminology James

Exodus 34 NWT
14  You must not bow down to another god, for Jehovah is known for requiring exclusive devotion.* Yes, he is a God who requires exclusive devotion.

Matthew 14 NWT
31  Immediately stretching out his hand, Jesus caught hold of him and said to him: “You with little faith, why did you give way to doubt?”+32  After they got up into the boat, the windstorm abated.33  Then those in the boat did obeisance* to him, saying: “You really are God’s Son.”

* Or “bowed down.”

Regards

LeClerc


So what are you trying to say here?

That the statements are in error, or some one bowed down when he should not have done so according to law?

Or perhaps bow down always means worship?

When did Jesus become a mighty god?

Could he ever become Almighty God?

What is taking place in this scripture?>>>\/


Jude 9
when Michael the archangel had a difference with the Devil and was disputing about Moses’ body, he did not dare to bring a judgment against him in abusive terms, but said: “May Jehovah rebuke you.

Who had the last say in this issue?


Try this months WT& Awake.

http://www.jw.org/en/
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LeClerc
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Joined: 31 May 2012
Posts: 2727



PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hello James

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

JamesJah wrote:


Now if you can get some bible terminology correct you will see that the statement Jehovah makes means all Christians must only worship one God not all of them.

Deuteronomy 12:2-5
You should completely destroy all the places where the nations you will dispossess have served their gods, whether on the high mountains or on the hills or under any luxuriant tree. 

You should pull down their altars, shatter their sacred pillars, burn their sacred poles in the fire, and cut down the graven images of their gods, obliterating their very names from that place.

You must not worship Jehovah your God in that way. Rather, seek Jehovah your God wherever he chooses to establish his name and his place of residence among all your tribes, and go there.



Lets examine some Bible terminology James

Exodus 34 NWT
14  You must not bow down to another god, for Jehovah is known for requiring exclusive devotion.* Yes, he is a God who requires exclusive devotion.

Matthew 14 NWT
31  Immediately stretching out his hand, Jesus caught hold of him and said to him: “You with little faith, why did you give way to doubt?”+32  After they got up into the boat, the windstorm abated.33  Then those in the boat did obeisance* to him, saying: “You really are God’s Son.”

* Or “bowed down.”

Regards

LeClerc


When did Jesus become a mighty god?

http://www.jw.org/en/


You can answer your own question can you not since you have already posted.

JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
LeClerc wrote:
Hello James

When does a creature become a god ?

To put it another way, when is a creature a god and when is a creature not a god ?

Regards

LeClerc


Good question as it is something most nominal Christians have a problem with.



The answer you have given means that you consider yourself a nominal Christian then.

This is the definition from the WTBTS web site

Quote:


p. 968GOD

Anything that is worshiped can be termed a god, inasmuch as the worshiper attributes to it might greater than his own and venerates it.



How are you with that James ?

Regards

LeClerc


What is wrong with that now do you have a campaign against the WT for some reason,  you do still preach the trinity do you not?



Your answer is ?

Regards

LeClerc
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JamesJah
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Joined: 30 Aug 2011
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Location: Sheppey

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Are all gods worshipped?

Should all gods be worshipped?

Do some worship gods that should not be worshipped?


2 Thessalonians 2:3-5
Let no one lead you astray in any way, because it will not come unless the apostasy comes first and the man of lawlessness gets revealed, the son of destruction. He stands in opposition and exalts himself above every so-called god or object of worship, so that he sits down in the temple of God, publicly showing himself to be a god. 5 Do you not remember

2 Thessalonians 2:3-5
Let no one seduce YOU in any manner, because it will not come unless the apostasy comes first and the man of lawlessness gets revealed, the son of destruction. He is set in opposition and lifts himself up over everyone who is called “god” or an object of reverence, so that he sits down in the temple of The God, publicly showing himself to be a god. Do YOU not remember that, while I was yet with YOU, I used to tell YOU these things?

Try this months WT& Awake.

http://www.jw.org/en/
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Powwow
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Location: alberta canada

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 2:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Does the watchtower believe the book of Isaiah? The ones that darken my door step like to point out the fact that Christ is not identified as the Almighty God but just the Mighty God. Yes the watchtower believes in not one but two Gods.
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cyberman
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Joined: 23 Mar 2011
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Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 3:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

JamesJah wrote:
cyberman wrote:


How many gods do Popes claim to believe in?
How many gods do you think they actually believe in?
How many gods do you think they ought to believe in?

You also referred to an error which modern Popes have made which medieval Popes did not make. What was that error, please?



 The Popes have made the problem of understanding which god is which or how many when they constituted the Trinity, that doctrine was to explain why there can be more than one God but there only being one God, the three leaf clover being used as an example of their reasoning.

The doctrine was constituted at the council of Nicaea until today.

Now if you wish me to explain that I am afraid I do not view things as they do I view things from what the scriptures teach, the three leaf clover is one of their ways of having three gods but only one God, not only do I see two gods but I see one who is greater than the other.

Why not find a Pope that can answer your question?


I am sorry but you haven't answered a single one of my questions. Was this deliberate rudeness? I wonder why you think rudeness is justified.

I would not wish to ask a Pope a question about what is in your head. I could ask them what they believe, but it would be fruitless to ask them about your opinions of their beliefs.
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JamesJah
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Location: Sheppey

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 3:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pow wow wrote:
Does the watchtower believe the book of Isaiah? The ones that darken my door step like to point out the fact that Christ is not identified as the Almighty God but just the Mighty God. Yes the watchtower believes in not one but two Gods.


No If you read this months you will see that the bible teaches that there are many gods, but they are not to be worshipped.


Try this months WT& Awake.

http://www.jw.org/en/
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JamesJah
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Location: Sheppey

PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2014 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cyberman wrote:
JamesJah wrote:
cyberman wrote:


How many gods do Popes claim to believe in?
How many gods do you think they actually believe in?
How many gods do you think they ought to believe in?

You also referred to an error which modern Popes have made which medieval Popes did not make. What was that error, please?



 The Popes have made the problem of understanding which god is which or how many when they constituted the Trinity, that doctrine was to explain why there can be more than one God but there only being one God, the three leaf clover being used as an example of their reasoning.

The doctrine was constituted at the council of Nicaea until today.

Now if you wish me to explain that I am afraid I do not view things as they do I view things from what the scriptures teach, the three leaf clover is one of their ways of having three gods but only one God, not only do I see two gods but I see one who is greater than the other.

Why not find a Pope that can answer your question?


I am sorry but you haven't answered a single one of my questions. Was this deliberate rudeness? I wonder why you think rudeness is justified.

I would not wish to ask a Pope a question about what is in your head. I could ask them what they believe, but it would be fruitless to ask them about your opinions of their beliefs.


I think Popes teach that there are three Gods in one?

You say they teach one God, which they also teach.

I think Popes teach religious tradition passed on to them by their predecessor's

How is it that I also think they teach a Trinity, how do they arrive at such an idea, if they only have one God?

Is there a new type of maths out there that I know nothing of?

.Try this months WT& Awake.

http://www.jw.org/en/


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