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Would it matter?
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Shrub Dweller
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Joined: 26 Jul 2011
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2011 7:23 pm    Post subject:  Reply with quote

SceptiKarl wrote:
cyberman:

Quote:
Is the bush itself reputed to have spoken?


Just to remind cyberman of the story:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burning_bush

In order for the bush to convince Moses that it was really, really Yaweh, (God), speaking via the burning bush, various miracles were performed on the spot, and even then Moses was not happy about it! I can't blame him. God of course then got angry! (Well it is the OT!)

Of course God got angry he didn't have anymore tricks up his sleeve  
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Shrub Dweller
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Joined: 26 Jul 2011
Posts: 387



PostPosted: Wed Nov 23, 2011 7:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cyberman wrote:
SceptiKarl wrote:
cyberman:

Quote:
Is the bush itself reputed to have spoken?


Just to remind cyberman of the story:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burning_bush

In order for the bush to convince Moses that it was really, really Yaweh, (God), speaking via the burning bush, various miracles were performed on the spot, and even then Moses was not happy about it! I can't blame him. God of course then got angry! (Well it is the OT!)


Is that a yes or a no?

You're a Catholic aren't you ? Don't you know your own book ?
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cymrudynnion
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Joined: 13 Jun 2011
Posts: 1208



PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2011 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Leonard James wrote:
Shaker wrote:
Leonard James wrote:
Whether we should obey the last wishes of the deceased is a matter of conscience. Promises are made to be kept I suppose, but if the person concerned is dead, they aren't going to know if you break it, are they?

Technically true, but if we can be so cavalier about ignoring the last wishes of somebody relating to their funeral arrangements, by the same logic we could presumably forget about making a will, if it can be so easily ignored/overridden.

I suppose if it's a written instruction in a will, it must be observed by law. Steve. I was assuming it to be just a verbal promise during life.
The problem with Wills as far as i know is trhey are usually read after the funeral so it would be too late. This has inclines to teh Organ Donor thread on R&E when I am dead I won't be here. Although i trust my nearest and dearest to carry out my wishes that is exactly what it boils down to Trust.
A former colleague of mine was a humanist.when he died the funeral was held in Thornhill Crem. Yes the Cross was covered although you could still see it but what surprised me was towards the end the celebrant suggested anyone present who was reliogious be now given a few minutes of quiet to pray for the deceased.
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cyberman
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Joined: 23 Mar 2011
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PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2011 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shrub Dweller wrote:
cyberman wrote:
SceptiKarl wrote:
cyberman:

Quote:
Is the bush itself reputed to have spoken?


Just to remind cyberman of the story:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burning_bush

In order for the bush to convince Moses that it was really, really Yaweh, (God), speaking via the burning bush, various miracles were performed on the spot, and even then Moses was not happy about it! I can't blame him. God of course then got angry! (Well it is the OT!)


Is that a yes or a no?

You're a Catholic aren't you ? Don't you know your own book ?


Not off by heart no! I don't think there is a talking bush. You think there is one. I think the story claims that it was God talking, and that his voice seemed to come from a bush. What do you think? Why are you never able to explain your own utterances?
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Shrub Dweller
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Joined: 26 Jul 2011
Posts: 387



PostPosted: Fri Dec 02, 2011 6:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cyberman wrote:
Shrub Dweller wrote:
cyberman wrote:
SceptiKarl wrote:
cyberman:

Quote:
Is the bush itself reputed to have spoken?


Just to remind cyberman of the story:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burning_bush

In order for the bush to convince Moses that it was really, really Yaweh, (God), speaking via the burning bush, various miracles were performed on the spot, and even then Moses was not happy about it! I can't blame him. God of course then got angry! (Well it is the OT!)


Is that a yes or a no?

You're a Catholic aren't you ? Don't you know your own book ?


Not off by heart no! I don't think there is a talking bush. You think there is one. I think the story claims that it was God talking, and that his voice seemed to come from a bush. What do you think? Why are you never able to explain your own utterances?

I have no idea why this subject came up but as you say it is a story, a myth, so does it matter ? If Moses was a little loopy then the voice would have come from his head in the way some mentally sick people hear voices and likewise the burning bush would have been an hallucination. Perhaps he had eaten some wild fruits which had a strong psychoactive chemical in it ?
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cyberman
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Joined: 23 Mar 2011
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Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2011 5:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shrub Dweller wrote:
cyberman wrote:
Shrub Dweller wrote:
cyberman wrote:
SceptiKarl wrote:
cyberman:

Quote:
Is the bush itself reputed to have spoken?


Just to remind cyberman of the story:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Burning_bush

In order for the bush to convince Moses that it was really, really Yaweh, (God), speaking via the burning bush, various miracles were performed on the spot, and even then Moses was not happy about it! I can't blame him. God of course then got angry! (Well it is the OT!)


Is that a yes or a no?

You're a Catholic aren't you ? Don't you know your own book ?


Not off by heart no! I don't think there is a talking bush. You think there is one. I think the story claims that it was God talking, and that his voice seemed to come from a bush. What do you think? Why are you never able to explain your own utterances?

I have no idea why this subject came up but as you say it is a story, a myth, so does it matter ? If Moses was a little loopy then the voice would have come from his head in the way some mentally sick people hear voices and likewise the burning bush would have been an hallucination. Perhaps he had eaten some wild fruits which had a strong psychoactive chemical in it ?


Thanks for coming Dweller. You have contributed nothing at all, as usual.
Karl thinks the story includes a talking bush. I think it doesn't.
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SceptiKarl
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Joined: 19 Oct 2009
Posts: 294



PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2011 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cyberman thinks I don't know the story of how God spoke to Moses through a burning bush. Well I do, and here it is in part for those who don't know it:



Quote:
1 Now Moses was tending the flock of Jethro his father-in-law, the priest of Midian, and he led the flock to the far side of the wilderness and came to Horeb, the mountain of God. 2 There the angel of the LORD appeared to him in flames of fire from within a bush. Moses saw that though the bush was on fire it did not burn up. 3 So Moses thought, “I will go over and see this strange sight—why the bush does not burn up.”
4 When the LORD saw that he had gone over to look, God called to him from within the bush, “Moses! Moses!”

  And Moses said, “Here I am.”

5 “Do not come any closer,” God said. “Take off your sandals, for the place where you are standing is holy ground.” 6 Then he said, “I am the God of your father,[a] the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac and the God of Jacob.” At this, Moses hid his face, because he was afraid to look at God.


Exodus 3 1-5
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Shrub Dweller
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Joined: 26 Jul 2011
Posts: 387



PostPosted: Sat Dec 10, 2011 3:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

cyberman wrote:
[quote="Shrub Dweller:62201]I have no idea why this subject came up but as you say it is a story, a myth, so does it matter ? If Moses was a little loopy then the voice would have come from his head in the way some mentally sick people hear voices and likewise the burning bush would have been an hallucination. Perhaps he had eaten some wild fruits which had a strong psychoactive chemical in it ?


Quote:
Thanks for coming Dweller. You have contributed nothing at all, as usual.
Karl thinks the story includes a talking bush. I think it doesn't.

Contribution to what ? What you two think on this matter counts for nothing for it is what the book or story says as to who or what is talking. As for what was actually going on, if this story is steeped in any actual event, then I would say my assessment is closer to the truth.
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SceptiKarl
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Joined: 19 Oct 2009
Posts: 294



PostPosted: Sun Dec 11, 2011 5:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shrub Dweller is probably right, imo.

Quote:
As for what was actually going on, if this story is steeped in any actual event, then I would say my assessment is closer to the truth.


Just what had Moses been smoking?
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cyberman
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Joined: 23 Mar 2011
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Location: Edinburgh

PostPosted: Wed Dec 21, 2011 11:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

SceptiKarl wrote:
cyberman thinks I don't know the story of how God spoke to Moses through a burning bush.


I think no such thing. Stop making stuff up. I have merely said that it is my recollection that the story does not describe a talking bush, but that the story describes God's voice which appeared to come from a bush.

Shrub Dweller's contribution - telling us he doesn't think it is a true story - is irrelevant - we are not debating whether it is a true story, we are debating the detail of the story.


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